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Home: Inactive Forums: Underwater Video:
Gates Diego for DCR-TRV900 & NiteRider Dual Beam Vector 2 Lights

 

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X-Jacques
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Oct 11, 1999, 12:25 PM

Post #1 of 33 (3712 views)
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Gates Diego for DCR-TRV900 & NiteRider Dual Beam Vector 2 Lights Can't Post

Anyone have any experience with the Diego for DCR-TRV900™ and the NiteRider™ Dual Beam Vector 2 Light System. Am curious about the benefits of this lighting system, especially since the power source is so large that it must be mounted to the SCUBA tank or to one's weight belt. Should I go for the housing and opt for another set of lights, ala Light & Motion Industries HIDs or Elites? Thanks.
Jacques


X-Gordon_Cancio
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Oct 11, 1999, 3:17 PM

Post #2 of 33 (3712 views)
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Re: Gates Diego for DCR-TRV900 & NiteRider Dual Beam Vector 2 Lights Can't Post

In my experience, anything less than 100 watts of light power is a waste of money. If you plan to do macro or closeup shots, using lights during day helps in dives deeper than 70 fsw. You'll notice this when you start editing your video of corals... You end up using footage of sun-lit stuff taken 35 fsw or shallower. At 70fsw colors of corals are too muted compared to the shallower stuff and they almost always look like video8 footage.
In my part of the world, the Philippines, the best time to shoot, sans lights, is between 10 am to 2pm, on a hot cloudless day. Unfortunately, this isn't usually an everyday event. Aso, given the limits of diving and surface intervals, the aforementioned time window will only allow you two dives of a maximum of 40 minutes shooting time. I say 40 minutes because that is the average maximum time of useful footage I can get from one charged NPF-730 battery.
The problem here is that to get practical use out of your lights for the length of the dive the strobe batteries become big and surface heavy. (I use 24volt/l50 watt lights from Dive Right and the battery pack is 18 inches long and 7 inches in diameter). This certainly not for the casual sports diver. But what the heck, I want the best picture possible.
If, Jacques, you take the route of a tank mounted battery, I suggest you use a back inflation bc. Try that with a normal jacket style BC and you'll be 99% assure of being out of trim, uncomfortable, and looking like an ogre from Notre Dame Cathedral leaning one side while finning along. The back mounted BC as a rule is also more hydrodynamic, and its intrinsic worth is more noticeable when you attach other peripherals like pony bottles, stage tanks, and even a tripod.
Just my thoughts,

Gordon


X-Bruce_Carlson
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Oct 11, 1999, 4:29 PM

Post #3 of 33 (3712 views)
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Re: Gates Diego for DCR-TRV900 & NiteRider Dual Beam Vector 2 Lights [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't completely agree with Gordon's comments. If you can afford 100 watts of light, then go for it, but there is a lot you can do with the NiteRider lights at only 20 - 30 watts. You certainly do not need 100 watts of light for close-ups! But pull away a few feet and the NiteRider lights generally light up only the central part of the picture. Wider, brighter lights would be useful for the wide shots illuminating a larger area -- the NiteRiders can't do that in the daytime. At night, the NiteRider lights are adequate for general lighting situations on reefs. I'd give NiteRider a passing grade among the relatively inexpensive lighting systems. That's my two cents worth.
: In my experience, anything less than 100 watts of light power is a waste of money. If you plan to do macro or closeup shots, using lights during day helps in dives deeper than 70 fsw. You'll notice this when you start editing your video of corals... You end up using footage of sun-lit stuff taken 35 fsw or shallower. At 70fsw colors of corals are too muted compared to the shallower stuff and they almost always look like video8 footage.
: In my part of the world, the Philippines, the best time to shoot, sans lights, is between 10 am to 2pm, on a hot cloudless day. Unfortunately, this isn't usually an everyday event. Aso, given the limits of diving and surface intervals, the aforementioned time window will only allow you two dives of a maximum of 40 minutes shooting time. I say 40 minutes because that is the average maximum time of useful footage I can get from one charged NPF-730 battery.
: The problem here is that to get practical use out of your lights for the length of the dive the strobe batteries become big and surface heavy. (I use 24volt/l50 watt lights from Dive Right and the battery pack is 18 inches long and 7 inches in diameter). This certainly not for the casual sports diver. But what the heck, I want the best picture possible.
: If, Jacques, you take the route of a tank mounted battery, I suggest you use a back inflation bc. Try that with a normal jacket style BC and you'll be 99% assure of being out of trim, uncomfortable, and looking like an ogre from Notre Dame Cathedral leaning one side while finning along. The back mounted BC as a rule is also more hydrodynamic, and its intrinsic worth is more noticeable when you attach other peripherals like pony bottles, stage tanks, and even a tripod.
: Just my thoughts,
:
: Gordon


X-Gordon_S_Cancio
Imported Account

Oct 12, 1999, 12:05 AM

Post #4 of 33 (3712 views)
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I stand corrected. [In reply to] Can't Post

You certainly do not need 100 watts of light for close-ups.
Bruce you are correct in saying this.What I meant was that I use my 100 watt light, (on jobs only of course. For fun? Are you nuts?), as a fill light to bring out the color of the corals whether on macro or wide angle
I sometimes spilt my lamp heads into a 20/30 watter and a 100 watter . The 20 watter to act as close up fill and the 100 watter to fill the background.
The 100 watter has a lot of "reserve" power. A 20 or 30 watter lamp is adequate for macro shooting.

Gordon


: : In my part of the world, the Philippines, the best time to shoot, sans lights, is between 10 am to 2pm, on a hot cloudless day. Unfortunately, this isn't usually an everyday event. Aso, given the limits of diving and surface intervals, the aforementioned time window will only allow you two dives of a maximum of 40 minutes shooting time. I say 40 minutes because that is the average maximum time of useful footage I can get from one charged NPF-730 battery.
: : The problem here is that to get practical use out of your lights for the length of the dive the strobe batteries become big and surface heavy. (I use 24volt/l50 watt lights from Dive Right and the battery pack is 18 inches long and 7 inches in diameter). This certainly not for the casual sports diver. But what the heck, I want the best picture possible.
: : If, Jacques, you take the route of a tank mounted battery, I suggest you use a back inflation bc. Try that with a normal jacket style BC and you'll be 99% assure of being out of trim, uncomfortable, and looking like an ogre from Notre Dame Cathedral leaning one side while finning along. The back mounted BC as a rule is also more hydrodynamic, and its intrinsic worth is more noticeable when you attach other peripherals like pony bottles, stage tanks, and even a tripod.
: : Just my thoughts,
: :
: : Gordon


X-Jacques
Imported Account

Oct 12, 1999, 9:35 AM

Post #5 of 33 (3711 views)
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Lighting Options [In reply to] Can't Post

     Thanks, Gordon and Bruce, for the great advice. There sure is a lot to consider when you want to do things right. A second lighting system I am considering is the UnderSea Video (USVH) HE-13N Lights Package or the USVH Single HE-13N Light. Spec on the HE-13N include two lamp heads, two 2600mah NiMH battery packs, universal charger that accepts 90-220 volts input, 2 lamps, extra o-rings, silicone grease, mounting bracket and screws to attach to a video housing; cost for that set is USD 1285.00. The Single HE-13N Light includes only one lamp head, one 2600mah NiMH battery pack, 1 lamp, extra o-ring, silicone grease, adjustable arm and 1/4-20 screws to attach to a video housing, but costs only USD 660.00. Any thoughts on the USVH gear.
While I am not a cheap skate, I do not mind saying that I do not like to spend money needlessly. It is for that reason that I have tried to steer clear of the L&MI HIDs and Elites. The wattage offered by USVH seems to run close to what you mentioned, Gordon, yet the price is nice. Looks like the set can also be mounted to Gates housings, too.
Thanks guys;
Jacques


X-Phil_Adams_
Imported Account

Oct 12, 1999, 10:31 AM

Post #6 of 33 (3712 views)
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I like that lighting configuration for macro... [In reply to] Can't Post

Not long ago,
I was using the AMPHIBICO Pro lighting system with the VH 1000 housing when they first came out with it in early 97. As I recall, I split the lighting heads into a 30watt / 75watt configuration for ECU's and Macro scenes, the 30watt being my primary foreground light, the 75 watt was a secondary background fill (less burn time, so I only turned it on when I was ready to roll tape).
I recall one fascinating scene I captured of a "Decorator Crab" whom dressed as though it was a Deer or Moose, in about 90fsw. It managed to attach two almost similar small branches (twigs) onto it's head in perfect alignment of one another, thus resembling giant, intimidating "antlers". I'd never seen anything quite like it.
By flexing the 30 watt foreground light at several angles I was able to capture various intriguing facial expressions as it scavenged and ate the dead carcass of a small fish. By flexing the 75watt background fill light into one fixed position I was able to capture it's shadow against the background reef wall. The shadow clearly appeared as that of a large Deer or Mooses' "antlers" in the background.
It was an hilarious scene, nature imatating nature, the funniest thing being I haven't the slightest idea where the Decorator Crab came up with the idea to cross-dress as a Deer or Moose.
Moral to my story, I really liked that particular lighting configuration for that particular macro scene, it was the perfect choice in capturing the charchter of the subject, at that particular moment.
However, it didn't always work well on every macro or ECU scene I ever attempted, experience has taught me to be prepared on any professional shoot with a variety of lighting configurations, from battery powered 30 watt incandescent's to surface power supplied 1200 watt HMI's. It really depends on your ability to conduct a proper pre-production evaluation of the target subject matter, when you want to acheive lighting perfection, technically.
Regardless, for recreational U/W Videography, I'd personally recommend an afforadble dual head, variable bulb wattage system similar to the AMPHIBICO Pro Lighting system I noted above, one with options to increase / decrease your foreground / background wattage requirements for personal desired effect, one that can, or can be custom designed, to attach to your housing for easy conveinience of use, thus allowing you maximum freedom of movement underwater.
One man's opinion,
Respectfully,
Phil Adams - Manta Multimedia Inc. - Vancouver, B.C., Canada



X-Warren
Imported Account

Oct 12, 1999, 3:10 PM

Post #7 of 33 (3712 views)
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Re: Gates Diego for DCR-TRV900 & NiteRider Dual Beam Vector 2 Lights [In reply to] Can't Post

: In my experience, anything less than 100 watts of light power is a waste of money.
The extensive experience of our customers and my own says you definitely do not need 100+ watts if the light emitted from the lights is evenly dipersed across the image. The camera you use is important and your VX-1000 needs more light than most of the digital cameras sold in the last 2 years. Jaques' TRV-900 will provide a better image in most conditions regardless of the available light.
:If you plan to do macro or closeup shots, using lights during :day helps in dives deeper than 70 fsw. You'll notice this when :you start editing your video of corals... You end up using :footage of sun-lit stuff taken 35 fsw or shallower. At 70fsw :colors of corals are too muted compared to the shallower stuff :and they almost always look like video8 footage.
Not with our lights and a digital camera.
: The problem here is that to get practical use out of your lights for the length of the dive the strobe batteries become big and surface heavy. (I use 24volt/l50 watt lights from Dive Right and the battery pack is 18 inches long and 7 inches in diameter).
Our battery packs fit in your palm and provide about 105 minutes of light per charge.
-Warren
UnderSea Video Housings & Lights
info@usvh.com
http://www.usvh.com
(916) 989-5438 voice
(916) 989-0298 fax


X-Gordon_
Imported Account

Oct 12, 1999, 4:11 PM

Post #8 of 33 (3712 views)
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Take the 2 lamphead version,!Quick,! Is your wife looking? [In reply to] Can't Post

:
I guess since diving is an equipment intensive activity, the question of relatively (to other sports) expensive equipment is a subject dealt with when we were all newbies.
A two lamphead configuration will give versatility to your shooting capability. A single lamp, though probably adequate for proper exposure aquisition, becomes boring after awhile.
I have not seen what the USVH system looks like. If you do get the dual system, I would suggest you get straight arms with lock-tight ball joints.
I've tried the multi-flex type arms.(They look like black ping-pong ball strung together like a rosary). They work well underwater, but out of water and on a heaving boat they can't seem to support relatively heavy lamp heads. This might not be the case when these arms are brand new. But I lost a couple of heartbeats when my lamp head, with a 300+ dollar glass cupola smacked lens down unto edge of my gate's housing's metal shade.
Fortunately, no cracks or discernable scratches. But I moved back to regular arms on the next opportunity.
regards,

Gordon

Thanks, Gordon and Bruce, for the great advice. There sure is a lot to consider when you want to do things right. A second lighting system I am considering is the UnderSea Video (USVH) HE-13N Lights Package or the USVH Single HE-13N Light. Spec on the HE-13N include two lamp heads, two 2600mah NiMH battery packs, universal charger that accepts 90-220 volts input, 2 lamps, extra o-rings, silicone grease, mounting bracket and screws to attach to a video housing; cost for that set is USD 1285.00. The Single HE-13N Light includes only one lamp head, one 2600mah NiMH battery pack, 1 lamp, extra o-ring, silicone grease, adjustable arm and 1/4-20 screws to attach to a video housing, but costs only USD 660.00. Any thoughts on the USVH gear.
: While I am not a cheap skate, I do not mind saying that I do not like to spend money needlessly. It is for that reason that I have tried to steer clear of the L&MI HIDs and Elites. The wattage offered by USVH seems to run close to what you mentioned, Gordon, yet the price is nice. Looks like the set can also be mounted to Gates housings, too.
: Thanks guys;
: Jacques


X-Phil_Adams
Imported Account

Oct 12, 1999, 4:43 PM

Post #9 of 33 (3712 views)
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Your new Canon XL-1 housing... [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Warren,
Since you're kicking around this discussion board, I was just wondering if your new Canon XL-1 housing can somehow support or accomodate the variety of shorter focal length Canon EOS EF lenses?
Respectfully,
Phil Adams - Manta Multimedia Inc. - Vancouver, B. C., Canada


X-Dale_Poff_Aqua_Productions_
Imported Account

Oct 13, 1999, 5:00 AM

Post #10 of 33 (3712 views)
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Light's Light's Light's [In reply to] Can't Post

Hey Guy's & "Gal's"
There is something you need to look at also, watt's is not the big thing alway's to look at. I have used 500wat systems before and got less light than 100watt ones.
The reflector is your big concern, why because this is what determines what your light is going to look like when it comes out. Some companies use a white painted reflector to defuse the light and this kind needs more watt's to get the job done and other's use a polished reflector, this reflects the light better and you don't need as much watt's and you get a longer burn time with the batteries but if it is not a good design you can get hot spots. L&M makes the best.
Also in the shooting I have done 100watt's is not to much for closeup shooting with a 3 chip cam. All you do is run the iris down.
Dale Poff
Aqua Productions


X-Warren
Imported Account

Oct 15, 1999, 11:22 AM

Post #11 of 33 (3712 views)
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Re: Your new Canon XL-1 housing... [In reply to] Can't Post

: Hi Warren,
: Since you're kicking around this discussion board, I was just wondering if your new Canon XL-1 housing can somehow support or accomodate the variety of shorter focal length Canon EOS EF lenses?
: Respectfully,
: Phil Adams - Manta Multimedia Inc. - Vancouver, B. C., Canada
We won't be making a housing for the XL1 nor the GL1. There just isn't enough demand for housing the high end Canon cameras. We'll continue to focus on the SONY cameras. Our top of the line offering will be the housing for the TRV-1000 out near the end of the year as a replacement for the TRV-900. The TRV-900 accounts for about 1/3 of our housing orders this year and I expect the higher pixel chips in the TRV-1000 will provide an even better image than the TRV-900.
-Warren
UnderSea Video Housings & Lights
info@usvh.com
http://www.usvh.com
(916) 989-5438 voice
(916) 989-0298 fax


X-Phil_Adams
Imported Account

Oct 15, 1999, 12:58 PM

Post #12 of 33 (3712 views)
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My mistake, [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Warren,
Sorry about that, my mistake. A friend sent me some info a few months ago on a new housing for the Canon XL-1, it was yellow and I must have mistaken your company's housings with Ocean Brite housings, sorry about that (I've had a busy week).
Phil Adams


X-Bob_Swick
Imported Account

Oct 15, 1999, 7:19 PM

Post #13 of 33 (3712 views)
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TRV1000 vs TRV900 [In reply to] Can't Post

Undersea Video Housings:
I just bought a TRV900. If I buy a housing now and upgrade to a trv1000 later will it fit into the 900 housing? If I knew of the new 1000 coming out before the end of the year I would have waited to buy!
Thanks


X-Dale_Poff_Aqua_Productions_
Imported Account

Oct 18, 1999, 4:12 AM

Post #14 of 33 (3712 views)
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Re: My mistake, [In reply to] Can't Post

Phil I think J-Mar make one.
Dale Poff
Aqua Productions

: Hi Warren,
: Sorry about that, my mistake. A friend sent me some info a few months ago on a new housing for the Canon XL-1, it was yellow and I must have mistaken your company's housings with Ocean Brite housings, sorry about that (I've had a busy week).
: Phil Adams


X-Phil_Adams
Imported Account

Oct 18, 1999, 9:17 AM

Post #15 of 33 (3712 views)
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Never heard of J-Mar, do you have a URL? (nt) [In reply to] Can't Post

: Phil I think J-Mar make one.
: Dale Poff
: Aqua Productions
:
: : Hi Warren,
: : Sorry about that, my mistake. A friend sent me some info a few months ago on a new housing for the Canon XL-1, it was yellow and I must have mistaken your company's housings with Ocean Brite housings, sorry about that (I've had a busy week).
: : Phil Adams


X-Dale_Poff_Aqua_Productions_
Imported Account

Oct 18, 1999, 10:38 AM

Post #16 of 33 (3712 views)
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I'll see if I can find it for you, I don't use them so I'll have to look (nt) [In reply to] Can't Post

: : Phil I think J-Mar make one.
: : Dale Poff
: : Aqua Productions
: :
: : : Hi Warren,
: : : Sorry about that, my mistake. A friend sent me some info a few months ago on a new housing for the Canon XL-1, it was yellow and I must have mistaken your company's housings with Ocean Brite housings, sorry about that (I've had a busy week).
: : : Phil Adams


X-Dale_Poff_Aqua_Productions_
Imported Account

Oct 18, 1999, 10:46 AM

Post #17 of 33 (3712 views)
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You asked for it, here it is [In reply to] Can't Post

<center><img src="http://www.video-seahousings.com/canon_xl.jpg"></center>


X-Phil_Adams
Imported Account

Oct 18, 1999, 12:12 PM

Post #18 of 33 (3711 views)
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Thanks Dale, that's the &quot;Ocean Brite&quot; housing URL listing I already have, I guess they are in fact J-mar (nt) [In reply to] Can't Post

: Jay -Mar it is now Video Sea
: http://www.video-seahousings.com/
: Dale Poff
: Aqua Productions


X-Warren
Imported Account

Oct 18, 1999, 3:48 PM

Post #19 of 33 (3711 views)
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Re: TRV1000 vs TRV900 [In reply to] Can't Post

: Undersea Video Housings:
: I just bought a TRV900. If I buy a housing now and upgrade to a trv1000 later will it fit into the 900 housing?
I don't know the measurements of the TRV-1000 yet so I can't say for sure that they will both fit in the same housing. If you ordered a housing from us today you wouldn't get it until late December (we would be working on it in mid-December) and the TRV-1000 will probably be out near that time.
We will probably be making a housing for the TRV-1000 with more features/controls than our present housing and it will be higher priced than the housing we now make for the TRV-900 (currently $1285).


X-Warren
Imported Account

Oct 18, 1999, 4:02 PM

Post #20 of 33 (3712 views)
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Re: My mistake, [In reply to] Can't Post

: Phil I think J-Mar make one.
: Dale Poff
: Aqua Productions
:
: : Hi Warren,
: : Sorry about that, my mistake. A friend sent me some info a few months ago on a new housing for the Canon XL-1, it was yellow and I must have mistaken your company's housings with Ocean Brite housings, sorry about that (I've had a busy week).
: : Phil Adams
A sore spot with me at the moment. The Video-Sea stuff is inferior to the housings made by at least 6 or 7 other North American manufacturers and being confused with them is unpleasant, to say the least.
I'm not surprised you confused the two names because last night when I happened by their web site the title of the page read
"Under Sea Video Camcorder Housings".
I guess they're desperate to get what they can even if it means misrepresenting themselves on the search engines (how if found them). I sent a request for them to change the title which I see they have done.
Warren (from the real UnderSea Video Housings)


X-Phil_Adams
Imported Account

Oct 18, 1999, 6:32 PM

Post #21 of 33 (3711 views)
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I understand your concerns Warren, [In reply to] Can't Post

Misrepresentation,
Is a common concern we both share, lately. I am glad to hear you have acted on this issue, yet sorry I was the one whom accidentally brought it to your attention. I hope we have not met on corrosive terms.
So many let similar occurances trickle by, not often realizing the negative impact on their particular business. I, as you, don't take any targeted acts of misrepresentation, or other damaging acts such as slander, lightly. I hope "Ocean Brite" or "Jay-Mar" (whomever they may be) respect your request.
We look forward to test-diving your Undersea Video Housings in the near future, if and when you should be so kind.
Respectfully,
Phil Adams - Manta Multimedia Inc. - Vancouver, B. C., Canada


X-Dale_Poff_Aqua_Productions_
Imported Account

Oct 19, 1999, 5:01 AM

Post #22 of 33 (3711 views)
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Re: My mistake, [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Warren
I know what you are talking about, the Jay-Mar is a low grade housing and I do not recommend them. However they are the only ones that I know of that make a housing for the XL-1 ( I don't like it neither ) A close friend had a Jay-Mar and had nothing but problems out of it on a shoot we had in Fla. on the Sub Races ( ISR ).
See Ya
Dale Poff
Aqua Productions


X-Dale_Poff_Aqua_Productions_
Imported Account

Oct 19, 1999, 5:04 AM

Post #23 of 33 (3711 views)
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That is not Ocean Brite ( nt ) [In reply to] Can't Post

: : Jay -Mar it is now Video Sea
: : http://www.video-seahousings.com/
: : Dale Poff
: : Aqua Productions


X-Phil_Adams
Imported Account

Oct 19, 1999, 11:38 AM

Post #24 of 33 (3712 views)
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Really? That's funny, [In reply to] Can't Post

Because,
After digging through my bookmarks, I found a URL that say's it is;
>http://www.oceanbrite.com/canonxl1.htm<
Phil Adams?



X-Phil_Adams
Imported Account

Oct 19, 1999, 11:46 AM

Post #25 of 33 (3711 views)
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Oops, here it is again, [In reply to] Can't Post

 

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