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Home: Video University Forums: Digital Photography for Videographers:
Calling Jenn M.

szerangue
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Aug 11, 2006, 1:20 PM

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Calling Jenn M.	Can't Post

Jenn, I heard you just bought a lot of Canon gear. In a recent post I talk about shooting an upcoming wedding with my little ole Rebel XT. There was some talk that you might be able to shed some light on Canon equipment and prices, particulary some fast lenses.
Miracle Pictures
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"Life Productions, coming out of the dark, into the light"
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Jenn M
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Aug 11, 2006, 7:18 PM

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Re: [szerangue] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi Shane,

Caution - it's highly addictive!

I do find a lot of helpful tips on Fred Miranda, and I also purchased quite a few peice of used gear there, all with favorable results. Here's a few things I learned, in general:

The Canon Speedlight 580EX comes highly recommended for the TTL metering. We have 2 and I do really like it. But you said you weren't looking to spend too much. The other common, less expensive model I see is the 430EX.

As far as lenses go, according to what I've read, when shooting with a crop camera, it's more necessary to go with better glass for tele, but not as important for wide angle, as the camera can't "see" that portion of the glass anyway, and this is the part which is most difficult for manufacturers to produce cleanly. Therefore, Sigma wides are certainly adequate.

I've found the mid-range zooms to be the most practical. I got the 17-55 IS which is made specifically for the 20D and 30D, but I also have the 24-70, and though I miss the wide end of it, I do like the tele. I think it's more importnat to have more room on the wide end because sometimes you can only back up so far, whereas you can always 'zoom with your feet' as they say.

I love the 50mm prime. I've read that some guys used this for an entire event, zooming or going wide mainly with their feet. And it produced a beautiful picture - so sharp and fast, for about $315.

I'm certainly not an authority on all of this (yet Wink

) but I have learned A LOT in the past 2.5 months since deciding to undertake this adventure. I've found the folks here at VU quite helpful, as they are came to photography much in the same way I am - after video. On the photography forums, however, sometimes they talk over your head, but for the most part, it's been very helpful.

I've been told to carry about 8-10 gigs of memory. Spare battery power for flash and camera. A wide, mid and tele lens (or at least the wide and mid). I've invested in a tripod and ball head, but I've seen plenty of photographers get away without using one all day.

I've found several helpful tips on posing by reading some wedding photography books and websites. Here's one I came across:
http://www.captivestudios.com/weddingposes.html

REally, it's nothing we don't already know, from shooting so many weddings, but it helps make you 'aware' of some things.

Hope this helps.

szerangue
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Aug 11, 2006, 9:04 PM

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Re: [Jenn M] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thanks Everyone and thanks Jen... all great info. I have the lens that came with the camera kit, the Canon EFS 18-55mm and the Tamaron 70-300mm. One thing I am concerned about, and I am really not sure what makes the difference, is the Rebel XT good enough to use with the right lenses or is it really a better idea to upgrade to a 20D or 30D body? Thanks for all the tips.
Miracle Pictures
"If it's a good picture, it's a Miracle!"

"Life Productions, coming out of the dark, into the light"
4EVER GROUP AFFILIATE

Jeko
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Aug 11, 2006, 9:29 PM

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Re: [szerangue] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

Shane,

Take your camera to best buy and take some shots. Then, shoot with their 30D/20D (onto your compact flash card) and see if there is a difference when you look at the images thereafter. That is how I evaluated all the bases & lenses that I considered.

Jeko

Sony VX2100's, iRivers, M-audio 24/96, Canon 5Ds/20Ds (and too much glass), Vegas6, PhotoShop CS3, Lightroom, etc.

Jenn M
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Aug 11, 2006, 10:46 PM

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Re: [szerangue] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

You can go here and compare the Rebel next to a 20D or 30D.
http://dpreview.com/reviews/sidebyside.asp

I haven't used a Rebel, but I have the 20D and the 30D. I definitely like the larger LCD screen on the 30D for reviewing the photos and the menu, etc. But the 20D is great,too. I got my 20D used for $800 on Fred Miranda (less than 2000 clicks - I thought that was a pretty good deal) and I see them listed quite frequently.

I guess your decision depend largely on how involved you intend to get in the future. I know of several photogs who use the Rebel 350XT (I think that's the model) and the kit lens for shooting a wedding. Granted, they aren't high end photographers, but it can be done.

The 20 and the 30 seem to be the most common choices.

With a 70-300 - that's a good range. But I would suggest a tripod at 300mm, esp in low light.

Jenn M
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Aug 11, 2006, 10:50 PM

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Re: [szerangue] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

Oh yeah - and we got some photog training DVDs on eBay and on one of them, the dude said he likes to use a 501 fluid head for his Canon with his extreme zoom lenses. We tried it and it works, so if you need a tripod in a pinch, consider using one of your video tripods.

Of course, you can't go vertical, but between getting a perfectly framed but blurred from shake vertical shot vs. getting a clean horizontal shot that can always be cropped later... go for the latter.

(This post was edited by Jenn M on Aug 11, 2006, 11:06 PM)

szerangue
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Aug 11, 2006, 11:09 PM

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Re: [Jenn M] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thanks, I will look into the 20 and the 30. I have a really light bogen tripod with a 501 head so I am good there. Looks like I will need a good flash and a good wide angle lens. I am just beginning this adventure so I am sure I will be learning a ton between now and Feb. I am actually going to shoot her engagement pictures October 1st in the park so I will have to jumpstart my learning pretty quick. Of course, I still have videos to edit and 4 more weddings to shoot.
Miracle Pictures
"If it's a good picture, it's a Miracle!"

"Life Productions, coming out of the dark, into the light"
4EVER GROUP AFFILIATE

RustyB
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Aug 12, 2006, 2:20 AM

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Re: [Jenn M] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

...Of course, you can't go vertical,....

That's funny. I was thinking of dragging my big nasty 3246/503 tripod if I shoot a wedding, to mount my heavy Zuiko 50-200mm lens to during the ceremony. I'm surprised more photographers don't use fluid video heads for the wedding ceremonies, instead of clumsy ball heads or those goofy photo heads with all the long adjustment arms sticking off of it. (I've seen photogs making a fool of themselves trying to get shots with those silly things quickly during a ceremony. Laugh

)

Then again, I guess one of the nice things about being a photog, is not carrying around such heavy gear. Videographers are simply gluttons for punishment.

As far going vertical, you might check the collar on the Canon lenses. On my Zuiko 50-200, it's only a matter loosening the collar knob, and turning the whole lens/camera 90 degrees clockwise or counterclockwise. The lens barrel and collar have markings so you can make the change instantly. So once you have your head perfectly level, you don't have to change it. I'd guess most brands have something similar.

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Scott Brooks
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Aug 12, 2006, 2:47 AM

Post #9 of 22 (2048 views)
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Re: [szerangue] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

I have the lens that came with the camera kit, the Canon EFS 18-55mm and the Tamaron 70-300mm.

I can't remember ... I was thinking on the original Rebel that the kit lens went from something like f/4.0 to ??? and it would not be near fast enough unless you're outside.

Also ... one of the biggest reasons to go to the 20D or 30D is that you can shoot at higher iso settings and still get great shots. As I recall the high iso on the Rebel isn't all that great ... even at 800.

I used to have a 10D and I didn't think iso 800 was all that great on that camera either.

I have two 20Ds and almost picked up another one the other day. You can find them for $750 and up, used. Then I decided since I don't currently have anymore weddings lined up for the rest of the year that I would hold off till next year (or if I book a couple more this year) and then decide what to do.

If I wait I can get a 20D for probably even cheaper ... but more than likely I'm going to end up purchasing a 30D. If nothing else I'm going to want the larger LCD.

Oddly enough ... I have no desire to pick up a 5D.

okspyder
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Aug 12, 2006, 9:19 PM

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Re: [Jenn M] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

Hi Jenn, I am just beginning my photo venture as well. Can you recommend any good training DVD's? I am looking for more technical camera training, shooting in manual mode, shutter speeds, etc. Thanks.

Anthony

Jenn M
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Aug 12, 2006, 10:36 PM

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Re: [okspyder] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

Here's quite a few:
www.photovisionvideo.com

I was looking for much of the same thing you described, since we already know how a wedding runs and what shots count. I was looking more for advice on appropriate settings. Of course, you have to sit through a little ego-massaging, but a few of the photographer featured offered what I was looking for.

We also got the Blue Crane Tutorial DVD on the Canon 580EX flash - also very helpful.

I see some listed on eBay every now and then, as well as the trading posts on www.fredmiranda.com

I can tell you one book I found very helpful-
Understand Exposure by Bryan Peterson

Hope this helps. Good luck! So far, I'm loving it. I practice everyday - I'm a big nerd! Tongue

I've been away from photography for so long - and the last time I really handled a still camera, it was 35mm. Digital is a whole new world.

PS What are you shooting with?

okspyder
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Aug 13, 2006, 1:05 PM

Post #12 of 22 (2005 views)
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Re: [Jenn M] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

I have the Canon Digital Rebel XT, Canon 50mm 1:1.8 , Sigma 24-70 1:2.8 EX DG & Speedlite 420. I figured by the time I really get the hang of this I will buy a 40D. I just purchased "Understanding Exposure" I will look into the Photo Vision stuff. Thanks.

Anthony

(This post was edited by okspyder on Aug 13, 2006, 1:09 PM)

Brackish
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Aug 24, 2006, 6:40 AM

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Jenn M
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Aug 24, 2006, 11:53 AM

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Re: [Brackish] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi Brackish,

As far as I know, it's simply a fast lens - great the low light abilities, and being a prime lens - therefore, super sharp. I have the 1.4 and love it. I definitely see the quality.

There's also a 1.0 but it has been discountinued. You can find them on eBay every once in a while for a huge lump of $$$. I'm guessing it was too difficult and expensive for the manufacturer to reproduce consistently, and therefore, they canned it.

Brackish
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Aug 24, 2006, 11:57 AM

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Jenn M
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Aug 24, 2006, 12:14 PM

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Re: [Brackish] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

I prefer using the 50 for "portraits," or formals - when I know I have more control over setting and where exactly I can place myself and the subject.

For example, in my limited experience, during actual prep, I would use the 17-55mm, b/c often times I'm in a cramped space and need to go wide and many of the shots need to include more subjects. However, for portraits/formals, the subject is usually limited to one or 2 people, standing still, and I can put them where I want them.

Also, those 'storytelling' shots are less likely to be enlarged, therefore, sharp detail doesn't count as much, but the portraits are more likely enlarged.

Does that make sense?

Brackish
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Aug 24, 2006, 12:24 PM

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Jenn M
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Aug 24, 2006, 12:49 PM

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Re: [Brackish] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

As far as group formals, I guess it depends on how much room I have - but I hope to use the 50m. Again, my experience is limited, and I haven't had to work with any large groups yet, so I don't know for sure. But I've been watching (spying) on photographers we've been working with and I notice that most use a lense in the 16-35 range on a 20D.

I thought about getting an 85mm prime, so I don't have to be right on top of the bride for portraits, but I'm waiting on that until I get more 'field experience' and see how much of a necessity it is. Also thought about the 24mm prime for those group shots, but I wonder how much time I'll really have to keep changing lenses. How practical and necessary is it, I wonder...?

I also have the 24-70mm, but prefer the 17-55 IS for the wide end. Though for actual ceremonies, I will be looking for more zoom (tele) and will probably employ the 70-200mm IS for that.

I'm so excited, I'm shooting (assisting) my first full wedding in September, so I'll know more for sure after that. So far, we've only been able to sneak some shots during our weddings after the photographer leaves. We also took some photos during our nephews Christening recently, and that gave us some 'church' experience, and I thought the 70-200mm preformed really well without flash in a dark church, so that's where I'm getting that information.

I do have a Sigma 10-20, but haven't had much of a need for it. I would say that is more for 'artistic' purposes, rather than documenting. From what I've read, most wedding photogs use it on a very limited basis, if at all. It's more handy for landscape shots.

(This post was edited by Jenn M on Aug 24, 2006, 12:50 PM)

Brackish
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Aug 24, 2006, 4:37 PM

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Jenn M
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Aug 24, 2006, 4:54 PM

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Re: [Brackish] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

No, I want a 100mm macro lens, but that, too is on the wish list, waiting...
The 24-70 has macro capabilites but they aren't fantastic. I suppose I could always crop the image, but I'm still going to get a better result with a tele macro.

And as far as focusing. I often use the center point AF and recompose the shot after focusing (usually on the eyes). Sometimes I use the 9-point AF when I can't pay as close attention and I'm just trying to 'get the action.' But I've also found myself using MF quite a bit, esp in low light or DOF shots.

AGain, I could be a complete hack, but we'll see. I think I'm on the right track. Wink

Brackish
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Aug 25, 2006, 5:49 AM

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Jenn M
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Aug 25, 2006, 12:23 PM

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Re: [Brackish] Calling Jenn M. [In reply to]	Can't Post

Yeah, 50 is probably not enough.
One thing I have to train myself to do is shoot full length. With video, we are so accustom to shooting medium to tight shots to preserve details and fill the frame, so that's my tendency. But with photo, I can go vertical and wide and still keep detail.