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Home: Video University Forums: Digital Photography for Videographers:
Online client print ordering - Print sales at reception

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Brackish
Veteran

Apr 14, 2007, 6:28 AM

Post #1 of 47 (2106 views)
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Online client print ordering - Print sales at reception	Can't Post

I see a lot of the photogs have up an online collection of all the images, so that the client's family and friends can order prints. I'm just wondering if it's worth the trouble setting this all up. Do you get many sales of prints this way? I just envision setting up all their hundreds of prints online and not getting enough orders to justify the trouble. Do you offer online ordering? What's been your experience with it?

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

(This post was edited by Brackish on May 14, 2007, 4:01 PM)

Jeko
Enthusiast

Apr 14, 2007, 8:18 AM

Post #2 of 47 (2098 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Some of it is print sales, but is is also for visibility. Friends and family are quickly linked to the images after bride/groom see them. Within 2 days, 30 to 100 visitors have checked out my work. Some brides go on these services to find their photographers by looking at complete shoot results.

Also, I mainly use it for B/G to tell me which images they want in their album. "Can you take the bride's picture out on page 17 and put in #332?" They are organized and sequentially numbered for them to tell me exactly which image(s) to use.

Image orders are high when they don't get them on disk --but even when they do have them coming on disk (only after album order), they still order some.

Jeko

Sony VX2100's, iRivers, M-audio 24/96, Canon 5Ds/20Ds (and too much glass), Vegas6, PhotoShop CS3, Lightroom, etc.

Brackish
Veteran

Apr 14, 2007, 9:35 AM

Post #3 of 47 (2091 views)
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Re: [Jeko] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thanks, Jeko.

What are some decent companies offering this hosting service?

And so you are saying that the B&G send links out to all their
friends and family once the gallery is up? Do friends and
family order any prints? Or mostly just the B&G?

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

(This post was edited by Brackish on Apr 14, 2007, 9:38 AM)

Jeko
Enthusiast

Apr 14, 2007, 10:00 AM

Post #4 of 47 (2083 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

I only know the service I've used... Pictage. There are several out there, but I really don't know much about the others and couldn't advise well as to which is best for the style/marketing you'd like.

Just like when you'd post a teaser of the wedding video online once it is ready, they tell everyone to go and look. It is a swarm. Who?? A huge mix of family, wedding party members, and guests/friends.

If the B/G have a package with images on disk coming, they will seldom pay for prints off Pictage themselves. But, those from afar, or friends the B/G don't see as frequently anymore will usually order a few. If B/G are not getting images on disk, they will order many... because after 3 months.... >poof<

Sorry to ramble. I just wanted to get to a >poof<.

Jeko

Sony VX2100's, iRivers, M-audio 24/96, Canon 5Ds/20Ds (and too much glass), Vegas6, PhotoShop CS3, Lightroom, etc.

Brackish
Veteran

Apr 14, 2007, 10:12 AM

Post #5 of 47 (2081 views)
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Re: [Jeko] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

????Poof

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

Jeko
Enthusiast

Apr 14, 2007, 10:24 AM

Post #6 of 47 (2078 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

>poof< = disappearing sound

Jeko

Sony VX2100's, iRivers, M-audio 24/96, Canon 5Ds/20Ds (and too much glass), Vegas6, PhotoShop CS3, Lightroom, etc.

Brackish
Veteran

Apr 14, 2007, 10:31 AM

Post #7 of 47 (2077 views)
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Re: [Jeko] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

>poof< = disappearing sound

You're saying after 3 months the orders stop coming in?

They lose interest?

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

(This post was edited by Brackish on Apr 14, 2007, 10:32 AM)

Jeko
Enthusiast

Apr 14, 2007, 10:45 AM

Post #8 of 47 (2069 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Oh, I wasn't very clear.

After 3 months, the images are gone from the site and they can no longer order any. With that being the case, they will order many and quickly. If they believe that they can get the images later (either directly from you or off the website), they are less apt to purchase images.

Jeko

Sony VX2100's, iRivers, M-audio 24/96, Canon 5Ds/20Ds (and too much glass), Vegas6, PhotoShop CS3, Lightroom, etc.

StillMotion
User

Apr 14, 2007, 11:13 AM

Post #9 of 47 (2065 views)
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Re: [Jeko] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

We use instaproofs. It is free to sign-up and no limitations, they jus take a cut on all orders. I would second the value of the advertising that it provides. I think having the option to order prints online, in general, will be as valuable as the quality of the photos. If your offering something really different, it gets passed around a lot more and you get orders from many people not connected to the couple (make-up artistsis, as an example). From a couple friends who are justs tarting out, I've heard that it doesn't do that much for them. We don't charge much for our reprints, from $3-15 as we don't give out the high rez files, so our income from that isn't that considerable but we can get $1-350 for a larger wedding in prints from outside the couple.

Patrick

Bill Grant
Enthusiast

Apr 26, 2007, 10:01 PM

Post #10 of 47 (1962 views)
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Re: [StillMotion] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

We use Photoreflect.com. Very easy to set up, and there's no charge unless you sell a print. Then it is 15% processing & 3%credit card fee. We get to choose the lab, but when an order is placed, it goes right to the lab, and they ship it for us. No fuss, no muss. We really like it. We have not gotten alot of sales, but currently we "give away the negatives" so we don't expect much, we just use it like Jeko says, for proofs.

www.grantphotovideo.photoreflect.com check it out...

Bill
Grant Photo & Video

Website http://www.grantphotovideo.com
Blog http://www.grantphotovideo.blogspot.com

rodovideo
Enthusiast

Apr 27, 2007, 8:19 PM

Post #11 of 47 (1934 views)
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Re: [Bill Grant] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

www.grantphotovideo.photoreflect.com check it out...

Bill

How did you create shot #17 in the Mary and El (1/29/07) ?

Is it a PS Action?

Look toward the Son, and you will not see the shadows

sample images from RODO PHOTO

Rodo Media BLOG

Bill Grant
Enthusiast

Apr 28, 2007, 10:11 AM

Post #12 of 47 (1919 views)
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Re: [rodovideo] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Actually, the bride did that & sent it to us for the album. Interesting eh? I can't find the software either. I assume it's just something they bought...
bill
Grant Photo & Video

Website http://www.grantphotovideo.com
Blog http://www.grantphotovideo.blogspot.com

Brian Coe
User

May 13, 2007, 11:59 AM

Post #13 of 47 (1815 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In 2006 we had the customers photos online with the possibility of ordering the enlargements for family and friends. Virtually no sales and we have stopped doing it for 2007.

BUT we now have invested in a Mitsubishi CLICK 5000 system and during the reception we print out the proofs (4 images per 6"x9") and we sell the enlargements (6x9) which we print out immediately and give to the guest on the spot. On average we are selling 2-3 prints per family and they get them 2 minutes later ! Prints are dye sublimation and very good quality. I thought that it would take all season to amortize the system but at the current rate it will be paid for in 8 weddings then it is pure profit from then on ! Obviously the guests are much more receptive at the wedding than eventually several weeks later if they ever look at the web site ! Also we economse the cost of shipping photos.

Last year I was sceptical of on site printing and thought that we could do as well with internet sales after the event; I was hopelessly wrong !

Brian
Elite Video Mariage
Paris France
http://www.elitevideomariage.com

Brackish
Veteran

May 13, 2007, 12:23 PM

Post #14 of 47 (1813 views)
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Re: [Brian Coe] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

In 2006 we had the customers photos online with the possibility of ordering the enlargements for family and friends. Virtually no sales and we have stopped doing it for 2007.

Hi, Brian. I was thinking about offering it but have decided not to unless there is a demand for it. I really doubt many/?any of the wedding guests will go to a website a month after the wedding and order prints. Someone mentioned that having a site up displaying your work can be good marketing because the potential clients look at these galleries when looking for their own photog. On the other hand, this same person (?StillMotion) said that he heard from a couple of photogs who are new to the business and tried it and found it wasn't worth the bother.

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

Brian Coe
User

May 13, 2007, 2:19 PM

Post #15 of 47 (1810 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

You could do what we do which is print and sell at the reception as this is where the business is, but we have a selection of photos and wedding book pages up on our site to attract customers - hopefully !

If you want to look go to our site, select "reportage photo" then either "Nos albums et photos" for sample photos or "Nos livres de mariage" for sample wedding book pages.

Brian
Elite Video Mariage
Paris France
http://www.elitevideomariage.com

Brackish
Veteran

May 14, 2007, 8:04 AM

Post #16 of 47 (1789 views)
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Re: [Brian Coe] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Brian, you're the first I've heard of offering printing at the
reception. I have a few questions:

Are people buying the 4 proofs on one 6 X 9?
Or just the 1 picture on 6 X 9?

What type of pics seem to be popular? Formals? Candids?

How much are you charging per print?

How do the guests see the varienty of prints that you
have on offer? Slideshow on laptop?

And how do the guests find out about your service?
DJ announces it?

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

Brian Coe
User

May 14, 2007, 1:40 PM

Post #17 of 47 (1785 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi

The 4 proofs on one 6x9 are only to show the images to the guests; not for sale.
We only sell full frame 6x9 photos

We print out all images as proofs and split them into 4 folders which the guests can consult. That way 4 sets of guests can view partial sets at the same time. We also intend to have a slide show going on a separate 19" screen which is driven by the Click 5000 unit whilst it remains available to manage the printing (but not got it working yet !)

The most popular photos are semi formals of entire families (without the B&G ! ) , I guess this is the one they can't do themselves with their dig camera or mobile phone. When we do the formals with the guests and the B&G , we always do a photo without the B&G at the same time. Generally while the B&G are preparing their next group we move the previous group to the side and take their picture on their own.

We charge 10 euros for 1 print or 20 euros for 3 prints , I suppose in percieved value this is about 10 and 20 dollars although the actual exchange rate is higher.
50 % go for 1 print and 50% for 3.

The Click 5000 control screen attracts plenty of attention plus we have several 16"x 24" posters displayed. But when the proofs are ready we get the DJ to annouce it.
Elite Video Mariage
Paris France
http://www.elitevideomariage.com

Brackish
Veteran

May 14, 2007, 1:55 PM

Post #18 of 47 (1782 views)
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Re: [Brian Coe] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

The most popular photos are semi formals of entire families (without the B&G ! ) ... Generally while the B&G are preparing their next group we move the previous group to the side and take their picture on their own.

Thanks, Brian. How do the "semi formals" of the family differ from the formals? Also, you have the B&G help in getting the groups together for the formals?

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

Brian Coe
User

May 14, 2007, 2:23 PM

Post #19 of 47 (1776 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Formals - semi formals ; its perhaps just my miss understanding of what you do in the states.

For me formals are pictures taken under near studio conditions with studio flash umbrellas etc and much time taken by the photographer to perfectly position all subjects. This produces excellent photos, although they all look alike BUT takes an extraordinary time to do. We do what I call semi formals where my photographers (or myself if I am the photog at the wedding) take posed pictures of the B&G and guests during the cocktail but not all in the same place and without the attention to detail that the formals have. The pictures tend to be more natural although less "perfect" because the lighting is less controlled, more varied and generally are prefered to the formals , at least here in France. And we don't disturb the flow of the day.

I suppose you could call our semi formals "posed candids" LOL
Brian
Elite Video Mariage
Paris France
http://www.elitevideomariage.com

Brackish
Veteran

May 16, 2007, 1:15 PM

Post #20 of 47 (1749 views)
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Re: [Brian Coe] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

We do what I call semi formals where my photographers (or myself if I am the photog at the wedding) take posed pictures of the B&G and guests during the cocktail but not all in the same place

Hi, Brian.

I would like to know a bit more about these posed pictures at
the reception.

Do you use backdrops that you set up?

What kind of lighting do you use? Light stands? Umbrellas?

How do the guests find out about this? DJ announcement?

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

Brian Coe
User

May 16, 2007, 7:47 PM

Post #21 of 47 (1736 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi

No we do not use back drops that we set up.
We try to find various natural decors that will do around the reception area. Usually we find something suitable particularly as many of our weddings are in Chateaux.

For lighting we use camera flash. Usually the on camera flash is 80% bounced off the ceiling if the ceiling is suitable or we put softbox on the flash if there is no suitable ceiling.

Sometimes if the formals are a bit more formal we also use a second or third camera flash controlled by the main one; in this case we turn down significantly the on camera flash so it only does light fill in.

(We use Nikon cameras with the SB800 flash units that can "talk" to other SB800 units in the room. The on-camera flash controls the power output of the other ones. This gives us pretty well the flexibility of studio flashes but the three flash system fits in the camera bag ! ! !)

In France people like having their pictures taken so generally everyone comes to join in and have their photo taken.

Perhaps this all seems very amateurish compared to usual practice in the States but it seems to be what the french B&G's want.

Brian
Elite Video Mariage
Paris France
http://www.elitevideomariage.com

DarrenS
Veteran

May 16, 2007, 8:02 PM

Post #22 of 47 (1730 views)
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Re: [Brian Coe] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

SB-800...the finest dc strobe system ever invented! I like them so much I have five of them.

Do you use the camera to control the remotes, or an on-camera SB-800? If you use the camera you should try it with an additional SB-800 as Master...way more efficient configuring power on the remotes. No menus to dig through.

Brian Coe
User

May 17, 2007, 6:00 AM

Post #23 of 47 (1705 views)
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Re: [DarrenS] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

I'm jealous; I only have three ! LOL

I use an SB-800 on camera as the master, much faster to configure as you say.

Which camera do you use? I have two photographers and myself with D200 and SB-800 and a third photographer with the Canon 5D and Canon strobe.

The Canon produces marginally sharper images but is less reliable on exposure with flash. The Nikon +SB-800 exposure control is unbeatable in my opinion.

We now record in raw and jpeg fine. The jpeg files are used to transfer to the print system we use at the reception venue, whilst the raw files are used later to generate the final images for the albums or wedding books. We have just started using Adobe Lightroom to manage all our images and to process the raw files.

"Awesome" as you americans would say ! ! !

Brian
Elite Video Mariage
Paris France
http://www.elitevideomariage.com

Brackish
Veteran

May 17, 2007, 6:09 AM

Post #24 of 47 (1704 views)
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Re: [Brian Coe] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

We have just started using Adobe Lightroom to manage all our images and to process the raw files.

"Awesome" as you americans would say ! ! !

Hi, Brian.

Do you find you can process most of your images
in Lightroom without having to go to Photoshop?

------------------------------------------------------------
HISTORY'S CLEVEREST FILM LINES

BERNARD: Howdy! My name is Bernard Posner.
CINDY: Oh, really?
BERNARD: Really.
CINDY: Is that supposed to mean something?
BERNARD: Around these parts, you hear the name Posner quite a bit.
CINDY: That's very interesting. You know, you hear my name quite a bit, and not just around here either.
BERNARD: No foolin'? What's your name?
CINDY: Up.
BERNARD: Up? That's an odd name. What's your last name?
CINDY: Yours. Up yours!

Brian Coe
User

May 17, 2007, 6:26 AM

Post #25 of 47 (1700 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Online client print ordering: Worth the trouble? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Lightroom is easier to use and better than Photoshop , from our limited experience, to get the best quality image in terms of exposure correction , colour correction and above all highlight compression which enables you to recover the details in the white wedding dress without affecting the rest of the image.

However if you need to retouch a part of the image only, remove a spot on the bride's nose etc. ! you need Photoshop or, at least I think that you do, as I am far from having explored all the possibilities of Lightroom yet.

Before we were using ACDSee Pro to manage image files which it does very well, but the image correction side of Lightroom seems to be mush more powerful.
Elite Video Mariage
Paris France
http://www.elitevideomariage.com

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