VideoUniversity.com
Home Free Library Store
Free Catalog

Please support VU by making your B&H purchases and links through this B&H ad. Doesn't cost a penny more. <a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com?BI=603&KBID=1017"><IMG src="/images/flash_ads/videoUniv2_revised_conv.jpg" alt="B&H Photo" width="260" height="70"></a>
Video University Sponsor
Advertisement

See The New VU Postcard Catalog

To post in the forums see the Forum Guidelines.

Join or Renew Today.
New Benefits for all VU Members
Forum Guidelines and FAQ
Main Index Search Posts
Who's Online Log In


Home: Video University Forums: Digital Photography for Videographers:
PS color management

 

 


Postal Boy
Veteran


Oct 4, 2006, 10:41 AM

Post #1 of 7 (576 views)
Shortcut
PS color management Can't Post

I did an 8x10 of our baby yesterday and it looks quite a bit different than the view I get in photoshop. However, when I open the same JPG file in a web browser it looks about like what was printed. Is PS doing some color management on the image that gives it a different look than the final output will be? If so, how do I get rid of that color management so I see in PS what I see in the browser (since the browser seems to give me closer to what the print is).

I don't have a CRT to calibrate so I have to wing it for now. The photo doesn't look bad, just a little "orange"

Postal


UPDATE:

I turned off all color management and that appears to be the issue. Now my question is this: On the Save dialogue it says that it is embedding the color management profile into the file. Shouldn't that allow the print to come out how the color managed file is, and not how the non-color-managed file is?


(This post was edited by Postal Boy on Oct 4, 2006, 10:45 AM)


Colvin ADTR
Enthusiast

Oct 5, 2006, 6:35 AM

Post #2 of 7 (562 views)
Shortcut
Re: [Postal Boy] PS color management [In reply to] Can't Post

Check your profile settings. It sounds like you are in adobe rgb and the web browser works in srgb and some printers do too. You can work in argb, which is better and then convert to the srgb profile to check that it is still a good match. You might also have a profile mismatch at the start which is messing things up. You can see the current profile in image size, I think or on the info bar.


Postal Boy
Veteran


Oct 5, 2006, 11:27 AM

Post #3 of 7 (552 views)
Shortcut
Re: [Colvin ADTR] PS color management [In reply to] Can't Post

I was in the adobe profile. I did not know that some printers use a different profile. I will play with it and see how it works out.

Thanks,

Postal


DarrenS
Veteran

Oct 9, 2006, 7:56 AM

Post #4 of 7 (530 views)
Shortcut
Re: [Postal Boy] PS color management [In reply to] Can't Post

Here's some tips:

Set your photoshop working profile to whatever your camera shoots in. If camera shoots in aRGB work in that. aRGB is short for 'Adobe RGB 1998'. If it shoots in sRBG like most cameras use that one. Some experts recommend working in huge color space (neither aRGB or sRGB are 'huge'), but I don't. Posterisation can occour too easily that way. If you shoot raw then save your output in aRGB because it allows for a wider amount of colors (bigger gamut) than sRGB and most labs will accept aRGB jpgs. If you're saving a picture for display on the Internet then convert (not 'apply', convert) the color profile of that image to sRGB because that's what most monitors are set at and that's also what most web browsers assume the image is. I don't think IE can even handle color profiles actually, and that's the only browser you care about. It just assumes it's sRBG, which sucks. RAW files don't use color profiles because, well, it's just raw data. They contain a color profile 'flag' with the meta data sometimes, but it doesn't matter. Then go download the proper icc profile for your printer AND paper and use the soft proofing function in photoshop to see what it will look like printed on that particular printer with that particular paper loaded. Don't buy paper from a manufacturer that doesn't supply proper profiles. All of this is useless if you do. Like the cheap stuff from Costco under the name 'Kirkland'. At first it seems liek a good deal but trying finding profiles for it. You won't. In fact the paper in the box could be from any number of different manufacturers. It's inconstent (like buying Lacie products...it's a bloody crap shoot what you're goign to get inside the box). Click View > Proof Setup > Custom and select your printer/paper profile and UNcheck 'retain RGB colors'. Leaving it checked will show you what it would look like without mapping the working profile to the second one (ie. usually pretty sad). Rendering Intent is beyond what I can describe here but for most cases use Perceptual or Relative. Then you can toggle back and forth from printer profile to working profile by clicking View > Proof Colors to see the difference. I'm no expert, I'm just learning all this crap myself so don't shoot me if I'm not totally clear :) I'm fairly certain it's accurate however, as it works well for me. My prints look as they do on-screen with the exception of the limitations of the printer. Few printers, if any, can reproduce the colors a computer monitor can. It's never goign to look as good on paper as it does on your monitor. At least not with today's printers.

All this is assuming your have calibrated your display with a colorimeter and generated an accurate profile for it. If you haven't then color management is all a waste of time. If you have, make sure you disable adobe gamma, which gets installed automatically by photoshop...or else your pc might get confused. I use a gretag-macbeth solution. It has more sensitivity to contrast than the spyder ones, important for wedding gown details.

Hope it helps,
Darren


Postal Boy
Veteran


Oct 9, 2006, 11:29 AM

Post #5 of 7 (523 views)
Shortcut
Re: [DarrenS] PS color management [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for all of the info Darren...the Gretag system looks to be a WEE bit out of my price range for now, but it looks like a good product..

-Postal


Wait...I just looked at the eye-one display...that is better. I was looking at the eye-one photo...for $1300 Unsure


(This post was edited by Postal Boy on Oct 9, 2006, 11:31 AM)


DarrenS
Veteran

Oct 9, 2006, 11:46 AM

Post #6 of 7 (519 views)
Shortcut
Re: [Postal Boy] PS color management [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes the Eye One Display Two (stupid name) is the kit I was referring to. About $200.


DarrenS
Veteran

Oct 10, 2006, 7:19 AM

Post #7 of 7 (503 views)
Shortcut
Re: [Postal Boy] PS color management [In reply to] Can't Post

There's another thing I forgot to mention which is very important: make sure you disable all color management in your printer's driver. If you fail to do this you will not have control over your color. In fact you'll be 'double-profiling', which is very bad. Let photoshop handle color, not your printer driver. Tell your printer driver to 'shut up and just listen to photoshop' Smile Each printer driver works differently so you have to figure out how to disable color management on your own. With the Epson 300 you click 'ICM' under 'Color Management' then check the box that says 'No Color Adjustment'. The other selections are 'Color Controls' and 'PhotoEnhance' and both will screw your colors up. If you do all this and the prints still look bad, perhaps the printer profile wasn't designed to be used outside of the printer driver. In that case you'll have to tell photoshop to 'shut up and listen to your printer driver' (in Print > Preview dialog box) then tell the printer driver to use the profile for your printer and paper (and sometimes even ink). It can be a trial-and-error thing.

This color management stuff can drive you to drink when you're learning it. I'm on my nineteeth bottle of crown and am just getting my head around it these days :) But once you 'get it' you will be very pleased with your results.


(This post was edited by DarrenS on Oct 10, 2006, 7:29 AM)