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Home: Video University Forums: Digital Photography for Videographers:
So you want to be a wedding photographer

 

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okspyder
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Sep 7, 2006, 9:57 PM

Post #1 of 42 (1918 views)
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So you want to be a wedding photographer Can't Post

I thought some might enjoy this.
http://www.beaumontcameraclub.com/...20Wedding%20Tips.htm

Anthony


szerangue
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Sep 7, 2006, 10:05 PM

Post #2 of 42 (1914 views)
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Re: [okspyder] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Wow, I have not read the article yet but I just noticed that the guy who wrote it is from Beaumont Texas!!! My home town! How Funny.
Miracle Pictures
"If it's a good picture, it's a Miracle!"

"Life Productions, coming out of the dark, into the light"
4EVER GROUP AFFILIATE


videochicke
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Sep 8, 2006, 10:49 AM

Post #3 of 42 (1872 views)
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Re: [okspyder] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for the info! I bookmarked it to read the entire article later, but am was happy to say I answered yes to all the questions in the first paragraph! My photographer friends are teaching me well!
Julie


szerangue
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Sep 8, 2006, 10:53 AM

Post #4 of 42 (1871 views)
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Re: [videochicke] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Well, sadly, I was unable to answer yes to all of the questions... I still have a ways to go. But one thing about that article, the basic tasks of shooting a wedding for a photographer or not much different for a videographer.
Miracle Pictures
"If it's a good picture, it's a Miracle!"

"Life Productions, coming out of the dark, into the light"
4EVER GROUP AFFILIATE


Postal Boy
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Sep 8, 2006, 11:49 AM

Post #5 of 42 (1862 views)
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Re: [szerangue] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Key difference...a photographer takes stills (camera curls), a videographer has to capture time segments in a way that can be put together later. Both sound very challenging if you break them down. The nice thing is, once you get some experience under your belt most of what he talks about (and what videographers deal with) comes naturally. Stressfully, yes, but there comes a time when a lot of the "thinking" part of it gives in to the "muscle memory" part of it.

-Postal


szerangue
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Sep 8, 2006, 12:01 PM

Post #6 of 42 (1859 views)
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Re: [Postal Boy] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

I agree... I do however, believe that photography, good photography, would be harder to capture at a wedding than good videography. Wow, I can't believe I just said that. What I mean is, in reading his article, it is true that you have to go in with an idea of what your camera settings are going to be for the amount of ambient light you have. You also have to know when to click that shutter or click it enough times to capture that on special moment that tells it all. With video, I can just push the record button, make my adjustments on the fly, and if I am able to position myself in the right place at the right time, I am going to capture the moment that tells it all. Especially if you have 2-3 cameras all recording the same moments at the same time. Both are great mediums.
Miracle Pictures
"If it's a good picture, it's a Miracle!"

"Life Productions, coming out of the dark, into the light"
4EVER GROUP AFFILIATE


Brackish
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Sep 8, 2006, 12:17 PM

Post #7 of 42 (1857 views)
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Postal Boy
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Sep 8, 2006, 12:21 PM

Post #8 of 42 (1854 views)
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Re: [Brackish] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Um....I refused to answer any of the questions to avoid self incrimination...


Jenn M
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Sep 8, 2006, 1:05 PM

Post #9 of 42 (1849 views)
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Re: [videochicke] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Julie - I need to be where you're at! I'm reading the article right now, and I can answer yes to everything except manual operation of the flash. I just can't figure it out. I can't seem to find very good instruction on it. I have to go on the internet and do more reading I suppose. I shoot mostly ETTL and adjust compensation. I'm getting REALLY frustrated with the whole flash thing - it's seems to be the only thing I can't figure out on my own. I'm stubborn that way - I like to figure it out myself.

Back to the books!


Jenn M
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Sep 8, 2006, 1:21 PM

Post #10 of 42 (1844 views)
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Re: [szerangue] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I do however, believe that photography, good photography, would be harder to capture at a wedding than good videography.



Really, you think so? I don't know, maybe I'm nutty but I think videography is much more difficult. You can't come in to something half way through like you can with a picture. If you miss half the toast with video, half a parent dance, half the vows - you're screwed. Photos - who cares, you can take 10 shots in a row and they can appear to be taken over a span of several minutes. If someone walks in front of you and blocks your video camera, you can't move without it being noticeable (camera shake) and you could possibly lose a huge chunk of the story which you know have to work harder to 'fix'. With photo, big deal, you step aside and snap off another picture. They'll never know when you took that photo. You can restage things much easier with photo, if you have to, though I would never rely on that fact. AND you can get your shot off before they even know what you're up to. With video, especially in a dark room (because we need those pesky lights) they see you coming and scatter.

And here's a biggie - You don't have to worry about what it sounds like! The band sucks? Who cares. The DJ mispronouces the bride and groom's name during the intros? So what. The MOH curses in the middle of her toast? Ha - you can actually laugh and not worry about whether or not you should include it b/c someone might get upset.

You can take 50 shots during the one and only song people get out of their seats all night, and the Client will never know they difference - they could think it was a rocking party and people were dancing all night. However, with video, again, you're screwed. You can't create something out of nothing. Video is more honest, which sometimes isn't necessarily a good thing.

With photo, you have much more control over lighting - backlighting? So what, use your flash. You typically have more cooperation from your subjects and your setting.

I'm not trying to say that there aren't challanges with photography, b/c I know there are. You have to know how to take a good photo, but once you do, you're golden. Perhaps it's because I've been doing video for SO long and I've run into so many challanges, which I saw the photographers skate through, I'm less worried or intimidated by photography. Do I believe anyone can pick up a nice camera and shoot killer wedding photos? No. But as far as the challanges go on the wedding day, I think video is much, much harder and I'm getting sick of it.

I've seen photographers snap off photos of ANYTHING - the bridal party just standing in a freakin' parking lot, and people think they're the greatest thing. Try including that in your video and watch people's eye glaze over.

Yep, I think video is MUCH harder. Just my 2 cents.


szerangue
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Sep 8, 2006, 2:11 PM

Post #11 of 42 (1829 views)
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Re: [Jenn M] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Jenn, I was not so much talking about the logistics of shooting a wedding video. Yes the audio is a problem, yes if you miss half the toast you're screwed, etc., etc... Given that, at least for me, that does not happen often. What I was talking about was shooting. Take the first dance (given you are starting at the beginning, given you are shooting with at least 2 video cameras), using a video camera to shoot the first dance, to me, would be easier to get that perfect moment than it would be with a still camera. Keep in mind, this comment comes from a guy who is comfortable with correcting exposure on a video camera and not comfortable "setting" exposure with a still camera. With stills, you have to go in knowing what you are going to do. You have to have the settings right before you get the shot or it's over; and it needs to be right the first time, or at least very close to right. With video, if they start dancing and I find my exposure is too low, I can adjust it on the fly. To me, it seems there are so many different settings you can choose on a still camera to capture the shots of a first dance to achieve a variety of looks. With video, I achieve a variety of looks with various angles and combinations of closeups and medium shots and a lot of my "artistry" comes in post production. I am sure that once I can use a still camera "steering by the seat of my pants" (as I do with video), then my opinion here may change.
At the last wedding, after the photog left, I got out my 30D and started shooting pictures of the dance floor. There was not one shot in all of those that came anywhere near looking professional. The background was too dark, the guest looked away at the exact moment I pushed the shutter, the arm was cut off at the elbow, there was nothing interesting, etc.. I just thought, wow, maybe there is more to this photography thing than just buying a nice camera and pointing it at people.
Miracle Pictures
"If it's a good picture, it's a Miracle!"

"Life Productions, coming out of the dark, into the light"
4EVER GROUP AFFILIATE


Brackish
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Sep 8, 2006, 2:37 PM

Post #12 of 42 (1821 views)
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RustyB
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Sep 8, 2006, 2:46 PM

Post #13 of 42 (1819 views)
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Re: [okspyder] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Sounds like someone a little bitter about wannabe-photogs, and feeling the need to justify wedding photography as a real profession, and not something that actually comes out fairly acceptable with those little plastic disposable cameras the bride leaves on the table(those were the best photos from my wedding). Laugh But none the less, the rant was entertaining, and did have some great tips for noobs!

Thanks for the link!


Beaumont....poor guy. I just got rejected for a wedding at the Beaumont Country Club. I'm guessing it was because my price was too high...I quoted them $1499 for a full blown package. I don't think it's a very good market out there.




Faith Poison Wedding Films Blog
Intergalactic Award-Winning Epic-Cinematic Wedding New-Doc Style Indie Fusion Bridal Movies on Hi-Definition Blu-Ray Disc


videochicke
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Sep 8, 2006, 2:48 PM

Post #14 of 42 (1818 views)
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Re: [Jenn M] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Julie - I need to be where you're at! I'm reading the article right now, and I can answer yes to everything except manual operation of the flash. I just can't figure it out. I can't seem to find very good instruction on it. I have to go on the internet and do more reading I suppose. I shoot mostly ETTL and adjust compensation. I'm getting REALLY frustrated with the whole flash thing - it's seems to be the only thing I can't figure out on my own. I'm stubborn that way - I like to figure it out myself.

Back to the books!


I think a lot with the flash depends on the look you want. And knowing what works best when. Ettl is great for many things. But manual has its place as well. I don't care for the look of direct flash. And I don't not like the feel of a bracket with the flash. So I have been playing with all kinds of options and settings. So far in the house, I like the look of the flash bounced over my shoulder or to the side where the wall and ceiling meet. This shot wasn't posed--the bridesmaid was just standing against the wall so I decided to practice on her. Flash over the shoulder, 1/25 second exposure at f5.6. The look it gives to me is extremely flattering compared to direct flash. I am very fortunate to have so many photographers willing to let me play with their equipment and pick their brains!


Julie


Jenn M
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Sep 8, 2006, 2:58 PM

Post #15 of 42 (1809 views)
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Re: [videochicke] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm pretty good with fill flash. It's those dark reception venues that are most challanging. And I believe that's when manual becomes most handy. When you say "Over the shoulder" what do you mean? Bounced with the flash tilted down a bit? Over pointed backwards, over your shoulder? Or do you mean mounted behind you?


videochicke
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:00 PM

Post #16 of 42 (1808 views)
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Re: [videochicke] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

And here is an example of flash use gone wrong. The altar was tan, but as you can see by the light on the floor the lights over the altar were a horrendous shade of green. This shot was taken with the Gary Fong thing on the flash. What I would do different in 20/20 hindsite would have been to put the flash in manual at full power, and bounced it with the white card out so the flash overpowered the lights from the ceiling (the ceiling was white) and got rid of those green highlights. Or taken the cup portion out of the Gary Fong thing so more light bounced off the ceiling and killed some of that green. Full power from the flash would have allowed me to increase the shutter speed to kill some of the ambient light as well. But since a mass was about to start, I had no time to play. :-(



Julie


Jenn M
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:07 PM

Post #17 of 42 (1806 views)
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Re: [Brackish] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

From what I've heard from photographers for years - their biggest frustration is the formals - trying to get people to pay attention and get everything the bride wants within a limited amount of time. But being a videographer, I'm used to people not listening to me, so no big surprise there. Wink As with video, I think it will help to have discussion with the couple PRIOR to the wedding day about this part of the event, to get everyone on the same page. I see so many photographers winging it, turning to the couple on their wedding day and asking them what they want. IMO, that is NOT the time to have that discussion b/c they have no clue and they are overwhelmed so they can't even think straight. Again, a little pre-planning goes a long way.

The other frustration is dealing with the uncle charlies and their point and shoots. But again, being videographers, we're used to everyone thinking they can do it as good as we can. Also, I'm not really expecting to make the bulk of my income on reprints, so I won't get all bent out of shape if Aunt Betty pops up behind me and tells everyone to wait so she can take her picture, too. Go for it. Who cares. They're either going to buy my prints or not. Whatever.

And lastly, the albums. First of all getting couples to get their butts in gear and pick the photos or give the final okay can be a pain in the arse. Then to pick it up. Then to not be nitpicky and want changes. Again, to me, it's not much different than requests for re-edits on the DVD. Lay down the ground rules up-front and have a pricelist for those requests.


Postal Boy
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:09 PM

Post #18 of 42 (1804 views)
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Re: [videochicke] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

But if the lighting was green, wouldn't you WANT to see that in the photo? Why use the flash to change the environment? Sure it was tan, but the lighting was green on purpose. At least the people weren't green Cool

-Postal


Jenn M
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:09 PM

Post #19 of 42 (1804 views)
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Re: [szerangue] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Shane, I'm just trying to make you feel better about it. Remember the first wedding footage you shot? I'm sure it was dark and out of focus and you missed some of the 'money shots' b/c you were adjusting exposure and the camera went black on you, etc. (speaking from my own experience).

Photography's not much different - you have to learn the craft, practice the art, and when you do, I really believe it will be sooooo much easier.


RustyB
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:12 PM

Post #20 of 42 (1803 views)
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Re: [videochicke] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Is she falling over? Tongue (Still not sure what to think about all the crooked still photos I see. I guess it's the norm. But, seeing it in stills has made me quit doing it in video...after seeing it in photos in looks odd to me now.)


I'm like szerangue, taking pictures of people is tough for me. I'm never happy with what I have, and it's tough to get it just right. And that's why I agree in that respect, that photo can be harder in that respect. You only have one chance to capture the EXACT frame in time where the subject is just right, whereas video you're shooting several seconds of frames. Video is just that...video of what happened. A photo has to be perfect, if it's going to be anything extraordinary...different from the thousands of other pictures being taken by guests.

Making a video is technically a lot more work, IMHO, but ANYBODY can make a video that the customer will love. All you gotta do is point the camera in the general direction of the subject and make sure they appear somewhere in the viewfinder....that's it...happy customer. I find taking a picture absurdly simple...but taking one of people that is exceptional very difficult.




Faith Poison Wedding Films Blog
Intergalactic Award-Winning Epic-Cinematic Wedding New-Doc Style Indie Fusion Bridal Movies on Hi-Definition Blu-Ray Disc


Jenn M
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:12 PM

Post #21 of 42 (1802 views)
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Re: [videochicke] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Looks easy enough to correct in post. At least the subjects are exposed well.
But I understand the desire to minimize post. boy, do I.


Jenn M
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:18 PM

Post #22 of 42 (1800 views)
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Re: [RustyB] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Rusty, Rusty, Rusty...
Sigh. I love ya but did you ever consider that maybe, just maybe, that whole 'as long as they're in the viewfinder' approach might be why your video biz fizzled? I'm sure it's partly your market. But I'm inclined to believe it might also be your marketing.

I hope you do better with stills!


videochicke
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:21 PM

Post #23 of 42 (1797 views)
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Re: [Jenn M] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I'm pretty good with fill flash. It's those dark reception venues that are most challanging. And I believe that's when manual becomes most handy. When you say "Over the shoulder" what do you mean? Bounced with the flash tilted down a bit? Over pointed backwards, over your shoulder? Or do you mean mounted behind you?


I like to twist the flash so it is pointing up and behind me a bit. So far for the reception, I like the Gary Fong thing the best pointed straight up. This kind of shot would normally be a challenge. Lots of white gown showing and the guest has a very light colored shiny shirt. But the faces look good without overexposing their clothes. But there is a problem with the pic. The dancefloor had a ceiling the was higher than the rest of the room, and it was ringed by a vertical mirror about a foot high. The Gary Fong thing fires in all directions so it caught the mirror behind me and made a stripe on the wall.


Julie


videochicke
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:25 PM

Post #24 of 42 (1794 views)
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Re: [Postal Boy] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
But if the lighting was green, wouldn't you WANT to see that in the photo? Why use the flash to change the environment? Sure it was tan, but the lighting was green on purpose. At least the people weren't green Cool

-Postal


The people are green. Frown There were normal colored lights on some spots on the altar and over the pews, but they must have purchased some bargain bulbs at one point. You can't tell from that small pic, but they all have bright green highlights on their heads and arms. Made them look sickly.
Julie


Jenn M
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Sep 8, 2006, 3:33 PM

Post #25 of 42 (1471 views)
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Re: [videochicke] So you want to be a wedding photographer [In reply to] Can't Post

Tell me if I'm crazy - but this is why I think photo is going to be less 'stressful' for me... I don't see that line on the back wall - I see a well exposed and happy bride with her guest. And I will bet my dog (and I love my doggie) that the bride won't see it either.

I really believe that no one cares that much, except for the professional who is less emotionally attached to the subjects. Maybe I'm taking a Rusty-approach to photography, but I feel as long as you captue the mood and the main players, throw in a few pretty pictures to float their boat, and make them look their best, they'll overlook the small imperfections we see, such as that line on the wall.

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