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Home: Video University Forums: HDV:
Which new HD camcorder?

 
 


RecTeach
Novice

Oct 24, 2005, 1:51 AM

Post #1 of 9 (1557 views)
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Which new HD camcorder? Can't Post
With all the great new HD camcorders out and on the horizon which do you guys figure will be the "best" all round buy for say under 6k? I am leaning towards the new Panasonic HVX-200 but I do also like what I see from the Sony's.

Any thoughts?


adtr
Veteran


Oct 24, 2005, 2:01 AM

Post #2 of 9 (1554 views)
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Re: [RecTeach] Which new HD camcorder? [In reply to] Can't Post
It isn't practical to play guessing games at that price range. I couldn't afford to gamble 5k on a camera that might work. The sonys are here, have been here for almost a year and still haven't produced any nasty shocks. If I am playing a waiting game, I may as well hold out until the varicam drops down to my price range.


Colvin Eccleston
manchesterweddingstudio.co.uk


videobear
Veteran


Oct 24, 2005, 9:20 AM

Post #3 of 9 (1546 views)
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Re: [RecTeach] Which new HD camcorder? [In reply to] Can't Post
There's no comparison. By that, I don't mean that one is a great deal better than the other, but that they are so different that a comparison means very little. The four biggest differences:

1. The Sonys are available now. The Panasonic isn't.
2. Sony records HD to tape. The Panasonic won't; you'll either need a lot of very expensive P2 cards, or an HD hard drive recorder (which also isn't available yet).
3. Sony uses the HDV format. Panasonic uses the higher quality DVCPRO HD format.
4. Panasonic will do 24p; the Sonys do 1080i, but don't have a true progressive option.




Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions


KevinShaw
Veteran

Oct 24, 2005, 9:26 AM

Post #4 of 9 (1542 views)
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Re: [RecTeach] Which new HD camcorder? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
With all the great new HD camcorders out and on the horizon which do you guys figure will be the "best" all round buy for say under 6k?
 Answer: two Sony FX1s. The Panasonic HVX200 will be an interesting camera which will probably get a lot of attention when it ships, but it's better suited for news gathering and movie making than for general-purpose videography. If you prefer a shoulder-mounted camera design the JVC GD100U is probably the way to go. But unless you only use one camera for most of your projects, the FX1 is easily the best value at the moment for an affordable high-definition video camera.


RecTeach
Novice

Oct 24, 2005, 9:30 AM

Post #5 of 9 (1541 views)
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Re: [videobear] Which new HD camcorder? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
There's no comparison. By that, I don't mean that one is a great deal better than the other, but that they are so different that a comparison means very little. The four biggest differences:

1. The Sonys are available now. The Panasonic isn't.
2. Sony records HD to tape. The Panasonic won't; you'll either need a lot of very expensive P2 cards, or an HD hard drive recorder (which also isn't available yet).
3. Sony uses the HDV format. Panasonic uses the higher quality DVCPRO HD format.
4. Panasonic will do 24p; the Sonys do 1080i, but don't have a true progressive option.
Re: point 2; I thought the HVX100 would record HD to tape.

Re: point 4; what is the dif. between 24p and 1080i? And is it true that the Sony does not have progressive scan? That would seem a little odd.

And finally, just to clarify, which model Sony are you speaking of?

Thanks for your input!


KevinShaw
Veteran

Oct 24, 2005, 12:44 PM

Post #6 of 9 (1529 views)
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Re: [RecTeach] Which new HD camcorder? [In reply to] Can't Post
The tape drive in the HVX200 will apparently only be able to record DV material; all other formats will require using either P2 media or an external hard drive recorder (e.g. Firestore). P2 media is expected to cost about $200 per minute of HD capacity at the time the camera ships, and the Firestore drives aren't due to ship until at least next March.

24p is the frame rate used by most movie cameras and a few video cameras; some people think this frame rate delivers a particularly desirable look. (Some people also believe that the earth is flat and that cigarettes don't cause cancer, but to each their own.)

Sony HDV cameras are primarily designed to shoot 1080i video with an alternate pseudo-progressive "cineframe" mode; JVC HDV uses the 720p format; Panasonic will support both 1080i and 720p. Progressive video has advantages and disadvantages depending on your needs and tastes, and how you plan to deliver your finished videos. (Most video is still delivered and watched in interlaced format.)


Stoney
User


Oct 24, 2005, 12:46 PM

Post #7 of 9 (1528 views)
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Re: [RecTeach] Which new HD camcorder? [In reply to] Can't Post
Here's what I know about the cameras:

Sony - Z1U (I think) or FX-1. The Z model has xlr audio inputs and some other menu driven camera controls. It will record HDV, DV and DVcam (and I think it will do pal and ntsc, I'm not sure). FX-1 has a mini-pin audio jack in and has less menu controls on the camera. I also believe it only does HDV, and DV. The Sonys shoot 1080i and are not true progressive scan. They do have a do have a progressive type set-up that I don't know much about.

JVC - Shoots 720p HDV format at 30p, 24p and maybe 60p ? It has an interchangable lense designed to shoot off the shoulder when not on a tripod.

Panasonic HVX200 - is a little bigger than the DVX100. It shoots DVCproHD, which is natively 720p if I'm correct, it can be set to 60p down to 24p and a whole bunch of steps inbetween. It might even be able to do a lower than 24p. HD is only recorded to P2 cards or an external HD. It will also shoot DV, DVCpro and DVCpro50. DV and DVCpro can be recorded to tape, but DVCpro50 would need to go to the P2 cards. I believe it will downcovert the formats to DV from the P2 cards or out the Firewire port.

I may be off a little on some of the information, but hopefully this helps out.
Stoney
LE 6.1, DVC-80, GL-1 & TRV900


RecTeach
Novice

Oct 24, 2005, 2:09 PM

Post #8 of 9 (1521 views)
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Re: [Stoney] Which new HD camcorder? [In reply to] Can't Post
WOW! Excellent posts guys! I really got a lot from both of them.

Not to keep asking dumb questions but what is the dif. between DV, DVCPro DVCPro50?

By the way I am an audio guy by trade so if I can ever help with any deep audio questions feel free to ask!


videobear
Veteran


Oct 24, 2005, 2:19 PM

Post #9 of 9 (1520 views)
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Re: [RecTeach] Which new HD camcorder? [In reply to] Can't Post
DV is the popular 25 megabit/second consumer digital video format.

DVCPRO is Panasonic's "professional" version of this format. Same picture quality, and captured and edited the same as DV, but a slightly higher tape speed. Provides greater resistance to digital dropouts. Sony's similar professional version is called DVCAM.

DVCPRO 50 is a higher quality digital video format. Same number of pixels as DV (both are standard definition, 720x480 pixel 4:3 aspect ratio images). However, DVCPRO 50 uses a 4:2:2 color sampling scheme, and thus has twice the color information of DV, which uses 4:1:1 or 4:2:0 (NTSC or PAL versions). This gives DVCPRO 50 an advantage when it comes to chromakeying. You can think of DVCPRO 50 as roughly equivalent to Digital Betacam.

For lots more on digital video formats, see Adam Wilt's articles in the VU Library, or visit his site at http://www.adamwilt.com




Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions