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Home: Video University Forums: HDV:
do you know...?

 
 


AndrewMSV
Veteran


Apr 5, 2006, 3:43 AM

Post #1 of 20 (3967 views)
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do you know...? Can't Post
I know I can easily test this myself, but my equipment is currently busy doing stuff. So instead of testing it, I thought I'd just ask you guys...


What happens if I put a miniDV tape from a camera shot in SD 4:3 in my FX1 and play the footage from the cam? What does the resulting footage look like?

Just curious.

Andrew
m o r n i n g__s t a r__v i d e o g r a p h y
sf chapter, vu california crew
I think we should turn that whole region into one shiny piece of radioactive glass. - CartoonChris



mcguyver
User


Apr 5, 2006, 4:09 AM

Post #2 of 20 (3965 views)
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Re: [AndrewMSV] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
It would cause the FX-1 to explode. Tongue




I would guess that it would look the same - SD 4:3. The quality wouldn't be improved any since it wasn't recorded in HDV.


Todd

____________________________________________________
Trapped on an island in the middle of the Pacific without a Swiss Army Knife
Armed with a Sony HVR-Z1, Glen's Canon EOS 1DMkII and Glen's G5 (Dual 2Ghz/8GB RAM/Dual 250GB HD/External 250 GBSATA RAID/ATI Radeon X800 XT).


AndrewMSV
Veteran


Apr 5, 2006, 4:39 AM

Post #3 of 20 (3962 views)
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Re: [mcguyver] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
Quote
I would guess that it would look the same - SD 4:3. The quality wouldn't be improved any since it wasn't recorded in HDV.
Crazy Obviously.

I was wondering because the FX1 cannot record in 4:3 so I was just wondering what playback of a 4:3 tape would look like.

I'm sure it plays back normally, I was just curious as to whether there is anything peculiar about it. I'm sure the heads read the tape exactly the same way any deck would and that the video signals would come out of the friggin' thing exactly the same as any other camera/deck.

It just sort of messed with my mind for a split second.

Andrew
m o r n i n g__s t a r__v i d e o g r a p h y
sf chapter, vu california crew
I think we should turn that whole region into one shiny piece of radioactive glass. - CartoonChris



KevinShaw
Veteran

Apr 5, 2006, 3:45 PM

Post #4 of 20 (3934 views)
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Re: [AndrewMSV] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
I keep hearing that the FX1 can record 4:3 SD video, but I've never done that so I can't confirm it. As far as playing the tape is concerned, I would think the FX1 would have to do so as recorded.


MSDowney
Veteran


Apr 5, 2006, 6:06 PM

Post #5 of 20 (3922 views)
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Re: [kwshaw1] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
I have the Z1 and I am going to try it out right now :)


Mike

Thomson/GrassValley


RustyB
Veteran


Apr 6, 2006, 12:18 AM

Post #6 of 20 (3903 views)
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Re: [kwshaw1] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
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I keep hearing that the FX1 can record 4:3 SD video, but I've never done that so I can't confirm it. As far as playing the tape is concerned, I would think the FX1 would have to do so as recorded.

Yeah, someone here also told me their FX1 would put the 4:3 safety bars on the screen. I thought this was a Z1 feature only, but they assured me you could do it with their FX1. But I've searched and searched, and yet to find that feature on my FX1. I'm pretty sure they were full of sh*t, and just an FX1 fanboy.

As far as I know, the FX1 does NOT record 4:3 DV, and does NOT include 4:3 safety area bars on the screen.

BTW, Andrew, if you play back a 4:3 DV tape in the FX1, it plays back in 4:3 on the LCD fine, even LP tapes, with the black bars on the side of the LCD.




the People's Video Collective blog
wedding video and the means of production


krskrewz
Enthusiast


Apr 6, 2006, 4:48 AM

Post #7 of 20 (3892 views)
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Re: [RustyB] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
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Yeah, someone here also told me their FX1 would put the 4:3 safety bars on the screen. I thought this was a Z1 feature only, but they assured me you could do it with their FX1. But I've searched and searched, and yet to find that feature on my FX1. I'm pretty sure they were full of sh*t, and just an FX1 fanboy.

As far as I know, the FX1 does NOT record 4:3 DV, and does NOT include 4:3 safety area bars on the screen.
I just checked and if you set the camera to record in DV mode, you can then go to Camera Set and change 'DV Wide Mode' to 'OFF'. When you do this, the screen will put the two frame bars on the left and right of the lcd and will also display 4:3 on the lcd screen.

I have not tried recording and playing back in this mode though but from the looks of it, it's 4:3 DV Mode.


(This post was edited by krskrewz on Apr 6, 2006, 4:49 AM)


RustyB
Veteran


Apr 6, 2006, 5:44 AM

Post #8 of 20 (3887 views)
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Re: [krskrewz] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
In Reply To
Yeah, someone here also told me their FX1 would put the 4:3 safety bars on the screen. I thought this was a Z1 feature only, but they assured me you could do it with their FX1. But I've searched and searched, and yet to find that feature on my FX1. I'm pretty sure they were full of sh*t, and just an FX1 fanboy.

As far as I know, the FX1 does NOT record 4:3 DV, and does NOT include 4:3 safety area bars on the screen.
I just checked and if you set the camera to record in DV mode, you can then go to Camera Set and change 'DV Wide Mode' to 'OFF'. When you do this, the screen will put the two frame bars on the left and right of the lcd and will also display 4:3 on the lcd screen.

I have not tried recording and playing back in this mode though but from the looks of it, it's 4:3 DV Mode.


Cool! Thanks for the help! Yep, it shoots 4:3 DV, with the framing bars on the side!




the People's Video Collective blog
wedding video and the means of production


DavidRennie
User

Apr 6, 2006, 2:51 PM

Post #9 of 20 (3862 views)
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Re: [RustyB] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
In Reply To
I keep hearing that the FX1 can record 4:3 SD video, but I've never done that so I can't confirm it. As far as playing the tape is concerned, I would think the FX1 would have to do so as recorded.

Yeah, someone here also told me their FX1 would put the 4:3 safety bars on the screen. I thought this was a Z1 feature only, but they assured me you could do it with their FX1. But I've searched and searched, and yet to find that feature on my FX1. I'm pretty sure they were full of sh*t, and just an FX1 fanboy.

As far as I know, the FX1 does NOT record 4:3 DV, and does NOT include 4:3 safety area bars on the screen.

BTW, Andrew, if you play back a 4:3 DV tape in the FX1, it plays back in 4:3 on the LCD fine, even LP tapes, with the black bars on the side of the LCD.

You can not record 4:3 but you can have a 4:3 safe zone on the fx1. To enable this takes two steps. First place the camera in DV record mode then from the "camera set" go to "DV WIDE REC" and set it to off. Presto you will have two bars on the left and right indicating the 4:3 safe zone.


RustyB
Veteran


Apr 6, 2006, 8:32 PM

Post #10 of 20 (3845 views)
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Re: [DavidRennie] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
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In Reply To
In Reply To
I keep hearing that the FX1 can record 4:3 SD video, but I've never done that so I can't confirm it. As far as playing the tape is concerned, I would think the FX1 would have to do so as recorded.

Yeah, someone here also told me their FX1 would put the 4:3 safety bars on the screen. I thought this was a Z1 feature only, but they assured me you could do it with their FX1. But I've searched and searched, and yet to find that feature on my FX1. I'm pretty sure they were full of sh*t, and just an FX1 fanboy.

As far as I know, the FX1 does NOT record 4:3 DV, and does NOT include 4:3 safety area bars on the screen.

BTW, Andrew, if you play back a 4:3 DV tape in the FX1, it plays back in 4:3 on the LCD fine, even LP tapes, with the black bars on the side of the LCD.

You can not record 4:3 but you can have a 4:3 safe zone on the fx1. To enable this takes two steps. First place the camera in DV record mode then from the "camera set" go to "DV WIDE REC" and set it to off. Presto you will have two bars on the left and right indicating the 4:3 safe zone.


Now you guys are really getting me confused.

I just recorded DV in 4:3 (with the shaded safe zones on the screeen, and "4:3" logo on the screen), then played it back in the camera, and it had solid black bars on the sides....4:3. Shocked




the People's Video Collective blog
wedding video and the means of production


DSE
Veteran


Apr 7, 2006, 12:49 AM

Post #11 of 20 (3823 views)
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Re: [AndrewMSV] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
Can't comment on the FX1, but the Z1 and M10U, and the M25U all play back DV tapes just as they were recorded. Put in a Panny 24p with 2:3:3:2, that's what comes out. Put in a PD170 4:3, that's what comes out. In the broadcast grade cams, you also get DVCAM, exactly as they were recorded. Remember, that's the "magic" of why HDV is so low-cost, is that it's built on the existing manufacturing lines that Canon, Sony, and JVC put in place several years ago. By virtue of the format, it *has* to play DV.

Douglas Spotted Eagle
Author, producer, composer
www.vasst.com
"I enjoy music, long walks at sunset on the beach, and poking dead things with a sharp stick."


steve
User


Apr 20, 2006, 12:02 PM

Post #12 of 20 (3690 views)
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Re: [DSE] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
I thought you would be the person to ask since I've read so many of your excellent reviews... I have been asked to review for the kenstone and lafcpug sites a new plug in by Red Giant called instant HD which is supposed to provide a conversion from SD to HD. However, first the interlaced footage(in this case, shot with a Sony 2000) must be converted itself to a progressive format. Its got to be a more complex procedure than simply applying a deinterlace filter to the entire sequence. Thus, could you guide me as to how to convert the footage to progressive?
Your help would be much appreciated.
Steve
www.worldfilmsandtravel.com


DSE
Veteran


Apr 20, 2006, 12:22 PM

Post #13 of 20 (3686 views)
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Re: [steve] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
Which host are you using it in? In AE, I used Digieffects, but Magic Bullet also has a deinterlacer that works very nicely

Douglas Spotted Eagle
Author, producer, composer
www.vasst.com
"I enjoy music, long walks at sunset on the beach, and poking dead things with a sharp stick."


steve
User


Apr 20, 2006, 2:16 PM

Post #14 of 20 (3672 views)
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Re: [DSE] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
Thanks for responding. I'm using FCP. Would the Magic Bullet deinterlace filter be any better than FCP's own.? Is there anything more to the conversion to progressive...just nest the sequence or clip and apply the deinterlace filter?
Steve
www.worldfilmsandtravel.com


DSE
Veteran


Apr 21, 2006, 1:21 AM

Post #15 of 20 (3634 views)
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Re: [steve] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
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Thanks for responding. I'm using FCP. Would the Magic Bullet deinterlace filter be any better than FCP's own.? Is there anything more to the conversion to progressive...just nest the sequence or clip and apply the deinterlace filter?
Steve

MB is better by a long, long, long shot. Try it, you'll see. Try it side by side, particularly on any image that's got some horizontal line crossed with a diagonal or circular.

Douglas Spotted Eagle
Author, producer, composer
www.vasst.com
"I enjoy music, long walks at sunset on the beach, and poking dead things with a sharp stick."


steve
User


Apr 21, 2006, 9:10 PM

Post #16 of 20 (3595 views)
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Re: [DSE] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
Much thanks. I've checked and apparantly the MB suite only works in AE so I will have to apply the filter there and then export the newly progressive footage to FCP before then applying their new Instant HD plug in for the review.
Steve
www.worldfilmsandtravel.com


Chuck_e7
Veteran


Apr 27, 2006, 4:26 PM

Post #17 of 20 (3482 views)
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Re: [DSE] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
Both my two FX-1's do the same!







"600 yards out, I can still see you!"


vsimone
User


Apr 30, 2006, 10:34 AM

Post #18 of 20 (3408 views)
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Re: [AndrewMSV] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
I shot all my weddings last year in 4:3 DV with my FX1. Customers did not want wide screen. There were no problems at all, you just have to remember the 4:3 safety bars are on the screen and shoot accordingly.
This year I am not giving my customers the choice of 4:3, I plan to shoot in HDV.

Vic


VX2000, HDR-FX1, Liquid Edition 6.1, Avid Liquid 7


KevinShaw
Veteran

May 1, 2006, 8:02 AM

Post #19 of 20 (3380 views)
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This year I am not giving my customers the choice of 4:3, I plan to shoot in HDV.
Note that shooting in HDV doesn't preclude you from delivering 4:3 SD output, but then that forces you to make compromises about framing your shots. I'm moving toward delivering all of my videos in widescreen format now unless someone makes a fuss about wanting 4:3, which so far doesn't seem to be an issue.


defocus
User


May 1, 2006, 12:20 PM

Post #20 of 20 (3357 views)
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Re: [kwshaw1] do you know...? [In reply to] Can't Post
Shooting in widescreen, it is easier to deliver a 4:3 product if the customer wants it because you still record the full 480 pixels. 16:9 degrades nicely to 4:3 than the other way around. I have no qualms shooting in 16:9.



thirteen years old and one bad kitty