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Home: Video University Forums: Marketing & Business:
i think i'm getting fedup

 

 


hardrock
Novice


Feb 3, 2006, 5:09 PM

Post #1 of 11 (1823 views)
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i think i'm getting fedup Can't Post

this is such a great site and i have been reading it for awhile now. just signed up today. anyway, my story is long but i will make it short, if possible. i'm a very hard worker, a workaholic. i have been in video for about 18 years now...and i'm 33. i have been recording music (guitar) just as long. i decide 4 years ago to start a video production co. on the side to put my talents to use. i dropped much $$$ on the perfect studio for my needs....audio and video. being a pc tech, i had to have the best pc's as well, etc etc.

here is the deal....after advertising on theknot.com and getting 3 weddings in 12 months, and now with modernbride.com and getting NO CALLS after 4 months, i'm thinking of closing the doors after 4 years. i wont' resort to putting flyers on cars. my joke is that i can't get business if i gave it away! not to be conceited, because i'm completely the opposite...but with video i know i'm very good! i should be with all the years i put into it. i get massive compliments and people love my work and that is great to hear since that is the main reason i do it BUT i can't get clients to save my life and i can't stay in business without money. meanwhile all the other losers are! i can't believe people get clients with the work i have seen. shaky cams, no tripods, no white balancing, jump cuts, etc!!!

i never quit anything but after 4 years and dropping hundreds on advertising that i didn't really have in the first place, i'm just lost. i revamped my website as a last ditch effort. i have no money for advertising.....the vid biz takes care of itself while my day job as pc tech pays for my life and family.

alright, so anyone else feel or felt like this? i know there are dry spells but i don't get it!

i'm currently waiting on a contract to get back to me in the mail from a referral. this would be my only wedding this year. they came to me, saw their friend's DVD, loved it, and needed a contract. sounds too easy. well i'm still waiting. they haven't returned calls or emails. been 2 months. i'm fedup.

sorry for the vent.....i'm just feeling very out of it and lost.

great to be here by the way!

steve



shop smart.....shop S-MART!


Bob A
Veteran

Feb 3, 2006, 8:12 PM

Post #2 of 11 (1816 views)
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Re: [hardrock] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post

With apologies, one more time:
IMHO wedding video seems to be the least profitable area of event video. I continue to be amazed at the time, stress and effort folks are clamoring to put into the seemingly least rewarding thing you can do with a video camera. I continue to see posts from folks with several weddings under their belt that claim they can’t afford a second camera or some other needed piece of gear. I don’t know whether they are poor money managers, poor business sense or just not netting lunch money from their efforts. I have repeatedly heard variations on your story. Sorry I can’t offer any advise to help your situation as long as you persist to seek weddings as you main video outlet. I believe that wedding videographers must be ego driven, trying to produce that great video for fame rather than fortune. There are some wedding vid folks doing well but it seems they are not the norm. If we can believe Rusty, he is a prime example – an undoubtedly good technician and has an eye for art, stays busy but struggles to keep sufficient beer in the fridge. What a shame!!
My recommendation would be to seek other things to point your video camera at! Any event that people gather to watch is a potential video income potential. Branch out and expand your horizons!!


videobear
Veteran


Feb 4, 2006, 10:20 AM

Post #3 of 11 (1776 views)
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Re: [hardrock] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post

There are lots of ways to advertise your business. You've mentioned trying three of them, a website, TheKnot and a bridal magazine. Here are some others:

- Networking. Talk to everyone you meet about your business. I mean, EVERYONE. Always give them your card. If it's an appointment, not just a casual encounter, leave them a demo. Meet with everyone in your area that's involved with weddings: bridal shops, consultants, reception venues, photographers, DJs, caterers, church offices, florists...you can also join a local businesssman's group, and attend their functions.

- Referrals. This is still the best source of business. Unfortunately, it takes time, because you need PAST customers to get referrals for FUTURE clients.

- Press release. Write up a story about your business, and submit it to the local papers.

- Bridal shows.

- Direct mailing. Get mailing lists from bridal shows, or simply watching the engagements section of your newspaper.

You can also expand the services you offer. Bob A suggests group events, like plays, dance recitals, cheerleading competitions, sporting events. There's also video scrapbooks, funeral videos, legal video, fim to video transfer services, PAL to NTSC standards conversion. Since you do music, too, there's all the services that field has to offer as well. Original compositions, performances, field recording of live events, studio recording services...

The other thing is HOW you market your services. If you post a link to your website, you'll get lots of feedback here on how you are presenting yourself to your potential clients.




Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions


videobear
Veteran


Feb 4, 2006, 2:18 PM

Post #4 of 11 (1757 views)
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Re: [videobear] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post

I forgot the most important one...music videos! They're perfect for you, since you have a recording studio. Just be sure to get payment; a lot of bands wanting to make a music video will poor-mouth you. Just remember that they had the money to buy all those instruments and amps -- they can afford to pay you if they really want the project.




Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions


Bob A
Veteran

Feb 4, 2006, 4:26 PM

Post #5 of 11 (1753 views)
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Re: [videobear] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I forgot the most important one...music videos! They're perfect for you, since you have a recording studio. Just be sure to get payment; a lot of bands wanting to make a music video will poor-mouth you. Just remember that they had the money to buy all those instruments and amps -- they can afford to pay you if they really want the project.


Unfortunately most local bands are really not making money. I follow several regularly (like tonight) and do video and just give them DVDs of their performances. I there is not much of a market for their CDs and DVDs. On any given Thurs to Sun night in my area (Eastern Mass) there are 100 local bands performing. Venues are paying $200 to $300 for decent bands for the evening and nothing to new or mediocre groups. Divvy that up between 4, 5 or 6 band members and they get gas money and occasional new strings for the guitar. One nationally known band I do, when they tour the northeast, commands like $1500 and up to appear but that is usually only for a Sat night and they are on the road 7 months a year. With down time and expenses they make about what a kid at McDs makes. I occasionally do some serious music festivals and state fairs music but don’t make much more than lunch money. Took in some good money this summer on one band concert but only did well because I matched all income from the event out of my pocket and donated all the dough to the Red Cross Katrina Relief Fund. Most bands do it for the love of it and I do them for the same reason. (but the chicks hanging around ain’t bad either!)



VidMan
Veteran


Feb 6, 2006, 6:07 PM

Post #6 of 11 (1676 views)
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Re: [hardrock] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm sorry to hear about your troubles. I know that theknot and Modern Bride are big ticket advertising methods. I looked at theknot and decided that for the cost of their ad alone, I could do much more direct marketing to brides. I have found the bridal shows getting me the best results. I can book 1/2-3/4 year just from 1 show.

Between theknot and modern bride, you are using quite a bit of your marketing dollars. If you have any marketing $$$ left, I'd try a bridal show if you can. Perhaps make friends with a caterer that has tastings. I am friends with one and they invite me to display my demo at their monthly tastings. Think networking as Doug said.

I went to your site and did not see any samples. Do you have any you can put up? Not so much for me but for your perspective brides. If you advertised in Modern Bride, do you have an ad you can post on your site? I'm thinking the site looks too corporate/consumer and not enough bride. Think about what the brides might want to see.

Hope this helps.

Thanks.

Brian
______________________________________________
VU Virginia Chapter


hardrock
Novice


Feb 6, 2006, 6:51 PM

Post #7 of 11 (1666 views)
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Re: [VidMan] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post

hey guys what's up? i really appreciate ALL your input! it all makes sense. and YES being a musician and an editor, i know the angles and i know what to look for, etc. so it's better to be a musician filming musicians just like it's an advantage to be a plumber and also have your video production co. if you are filming plumbing vids. you know what i mean.

anyway, i have advertised everywhere, guitar centers, clubs, local band mags....BANDS HAVE NO MONEY. and when i was playing out...we had enough for mcdee's after the show! you do it cuz you love it. i get 1 band every 8 months or so. it's sick. so i will use my gear for my music and my band i'm forming.

as far as scouring the newspapers for engagement releases, etc. and all the other homework related....i just don't have time for that since i have the day job of 50 hours a week working downtown as a pc / networking tech. so i need something where i can just post and have them come to me!

so today i did an impluse thing...i went with the knot again. but i will only do it for 6 months and i will not get upset if i get nothing. if i get stuff i will see it as icing on the cake. i'm tired of filming weddings and i think that is mainly cuz i'm tired of getting shot down, too much cut throat in the biz.........i did get 4 weddings last year from it. YEAH I KNOW....OH BOY! but if i can just get 3 weddings it will pay for the 6 months advertising and give me some in the bank.....and pay for some expenses with gear. after that, i believe i will just calm way down with it since the frustration is not worth it at all. i will focus on my music and myself. i thought about it long and hard and i gave up music and my band and stuff like that to pursue this 4 years ago. DUMB! i really was afraid of too much business with my day job, etc. what a joke.

anyway, if you have more ideas keep 'em comin'. i love to read the stuff. i do have samples on my site and maybe you are looking at the wrong site. www.sarweddings.com is for my weddings and www.sarproductions.com is for other video stuff such as bands...which will also be redone. i hate the way that looks.

thanks!
steve



shop smart.....shop S-MART!

(This post was edited by hardrock on Feb 6, 2006, 6:54 PM)


bbalser
User

Feb 13, 2006, 1:33 AM

Post #8 of 11 (1488 views)
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Re: [hardrock] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post

Music videos are harder to sell a client on and an even lower profit margin than weddings.

I know a lot of wedding videographers in many markets around the country who are doing really good business. Booked solid all the time, great pricing, doing very well for themselves. It's not the business, it's the marketing.

I find most videographers have little to no sales/marketing sense. You really need to simply educate yourself. Marketing is not a common sense thing to do.


hardrock
Novice


Feb 13, 2006, 2:40 AM

Post #9 of 11 (1482 views)
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Re: [bbalser] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post

you got that right! i have spent a lot of money in marketing in all the large magazines. my site is very nice, work is really nice, and i'm a perfectionist. and yet....nothing. well ok, 4 weddings a year....bid deal! it's frustrating and i'm not a quitter but after 3 years of this.......i give it 6 more months. i will still do stuff if someone inquires but i'm not looking. either that or team up with someone who is into marketing and advertising. i hate it to tell you the truth! all my time is focused on that BS instead of my talents! not to mention with a regular day job.....it is pretty rough. i feel like a machine most of the time. always surfing and marketing and spending money for very little return. as someone said earlier, this is not BACK IN THE DAY! everyone has digital whatever nowadays! it's more cut-throat than it ever was. everyone is shooting video and photography nowadays. just like back in the day...your band WENT TO A STUDIO.....now everyone can have a nice studio to turn out demos to show around to club owners...........the studio is in their home. anyone with $500 can get a nice setup for demos.

thanks for your posts!
steve



shop smart.....shop S-MART!


bladeronner
Enthusiast


Feb 15, 2006, 2:05 AM

Post #10 of 11 (1402 views)
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Re: [Bob A] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
>>I continue to be amazed at the time, stress and effort folks are clamoring to put into the seemingly least rewarding thing you can do with a video camera.<<

I must humbly disagree with you on this. I'm actually qutie shocked to see such a statement. Producing a professional video production of perhaps the most important, romantic, private, personal, and spiritual day of a couple's life is in my opinion one of the MOST rewarding things you can do with a video camera.

>>I believe that wedding videographers must be ego driven, trying to produce that great video for fame rather than fortune. There are some wedding vid folks doing well but it seems they are not the norm. <<

As Rain Man would say, there are "lots and lots of 'em." That is, wedding videographers who make a great living.

>>My recommendation would be to seek other things to point your video camera at!<<
I disagree with this suggestion only because Hardrock will have the same problem with any market he targets if his sales and marketing aren't on point. As BBalser said, it's not the industry, it's the marketing.

I understand that your outlook on wedding videography is a result of your personal experiences. I just want to share with the group that based on MY experiences and colleagues, Wedding Videography is alive and well and one of the most rewarding and fulfilling jobs one can have. We make memorable, meanginful, and magnificent movies of the most important moments in a couple's life. We create works of art that have the power to save marriages and bring families closer together. We create movies that make people laugh and cry. We often capture the last living moments of those who will soon depart us (e.g. grandparents nearing death's door; fathers of brides who die of a stroke 6 months after the wedding and only two weeks before Christmas; etc.) How can anyone say that isn't rewarding.

Yes, it is tough to be a success at this business. Name a business where that ISN'T the case. And yes, corporate work is generally more profitable that wedding work (on an hourly basis). But if you market yourself right, AND if you have the talent and work to back it up, you can be amazingly successful in this business, and earn what you're worth. In fact, I submit that wedding videography is the only aspect of video production where the earning potential can actually eclipse all over forms of video production. Due to the nature of the business, "celebrity" videographers earn $10k to $30K per wedding, strictly because they are THE videographer to have. A corporation won't pay a significant premeium for a production company just because XYZ Corp. used. them. However, there are brides who will pay a premium for a videographer just because they did So-and-so's wedding.

Hardrock, feel free to email or call me if you'd like one on one advice and encouragement. I'd be happy to share with you what has helped our company succeed in this market. (We've been in business almost four years).

Wishing you all the best,
Ron

Ron Dawson
Cinematic Studios Inc.
The blog
Ron's Face Book
Follow Ron on Twitter


bladeronner
Enthusiast


Feb 15, 2006, 2:13 AM

Post #11 of 11 (1396 views)
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Re: [hardrock] i think i'm getting fedup [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Hardrock,

I can certainly understand your frustration. I took the liberty of reviewing your website. Feel free to email me so we can set up a phone call. I'd be more than happy to talk you through some constructive criticisms I have, as well as share with you what has been successful for our business. And yes, I know we're in different markets, but I submit that it doesn't matter.

You can absolutely be a success in this business, while at the same time being fulfilled and rewarded appropriately. Sometimes it just needs a helping hand.

All the best,
Ron
Ron Dawson
Cinematic Studios Inc.
The blog
Ron's Face Book
Follow Ron on Twitter