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Home: Video University Forums: Tech Q & A:
External DV Decks

 

 


dansen
User


Oct 5, 2005, 1:04 PM

Post #1 of 21 (3884 views)
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External DV Decks Can't Post

Hi, I'm reading a Final Cut Pro manual and looking at the basic configuration set up. What the hell is a deck? It always says "connect to DV camcorder or deck". I assume it's just an external device you can put a DV tape into and then have it play into your G5? Where can you get these contraptions? What are they called?

Also, it says that you must connect an external A/V HD? Any ideas? Is this just a normal DVD player? If anyone can help I'd appreciate it. Thanks.


videobear
Veteran


Oct 5, 2005, 5:51 PM

Post #2 of 21 (3855 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
What the hell is a deck?



You are kidding, right? Shocked

The word "deck" has many meanings, of course...a pack of playing cards, the part of a ship you stand on, an extended wooden porch at the back of your house, to knock someone to the ground...

But in this case, a "deck" is a VTR or VCR...a Video Tape Recorder or Video Cassette Recorder. Think of it as a camcorder without a lens. Wink

How did they become known as "decks"? The term goes back at least as far as reel-to-reel audio recording days, but I have no idea where it originated.




Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions


dansen
User


Oct 5, 2005, 6:05 PM

Post #3 of 21 (3854 views)
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Re: [videobear] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

And how are you supposed to get DV footage into a G5 with a VCR? Obviously a deck will have a slot where you can put a mini-DV tape so you won't have to use your camera all the time. That's what i meant.


eagle eye
User

Oct 7, 2005, 1:40 PM

Post #4 of 21 (3825 views)
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Re: [videobear] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

also,
Clear the deck!
hit the deck!
who's on deck?
deck the halls

I can only remember back as far as 8 track deck.


DaveC
Novice

Oct 7, 2005, 7:50 PM

Post #5 of 21 (3808 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
And how are you supposed to get DV footage into a G5 with a VCR? Obviously a deck will have a slot where you can put a mini-DV tape so you won't have to use your camera all the time. That's what i meant.

There aren't many. The only one that I know of that is under $1000 is the JVC SR-VS30U at $829.95 plus S&H. There are several in the multi $1000 range but only corporations can afford those. I think most people use their camcorder because nobody can afford a DV VCR.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/...e=categoryNavigation

By the way, I think this JVC will only playback MiniDV tapes and not record them so it is not a true MiniDV VCR, it is only a DV player. If you want to use a deck to record you are probably looking at a $2000 and up machine.

Just use your camcorder as a DV VCR and stop worrying about wearing it out. You can probably buy a new camcorder cheaper than a DV VCR.

Dave


(This post was edited by DaveC on Oct 7, 2005, 7:59 PM)


videobear
Veteran


Oct 7, 2005, 7:50 PM

Post #6 of 21 (3807 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
And how are you supposed to get DV footage into a G5 with a VCR?



The same way you do it with your camcorder -- through a Firewire cable. DV decks all have Firewire interfaces, in addition to the more common composite and S-video connections.

To see what a DV deck is, go to http://www.bhphotovideo.com and browse as follows:
Video - Professional
Post Production/VCRs, DVDs, and Accessories
VCRs and DVDs
VCR Players and Recorders
In the search box for "Format", choose "DV".




Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions


Beverly
User


Oct 7, 2005, 8:33 PM

Post #7 of 21 (3800 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

Here is the deck that I have and love it you can patch a VCR through it so you can capture from analog it hold mini DV and DVcam tapes. It also has a microphone input where you can capture voice overs straight into the computer or onto a tape using the deck. Great tool. It is WAY cheaper now then when I intually bougth it.

http://www.jr.com/...atafeed.PAN+AGDV2000


Bob A
Veteran


Oct 8, 2005, 6:52 AM

Post #8 of 21 (3770 views)
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Re: [DaveC] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
There aren't many. The only one that I know of that is under $1000 is the JVC SR-VS30U at $829.95 plus S&H. There are several in the multi $1000 range but only corporations can afford those. I think most people use their camcorder because nobody can afford a DV VCR.

By the way, I think this JVC will only playback MiniDV tapes and not record them so it is not a true MiniDV VCR, it is only a DV player. If you want to use a deck to record you are probably looking at a $2000 and up machine.

Just use your camcorder as a DV VCR and stop worrying about wearing it out. You can probably buy a new camcorder cheaper than a DV VCR.

Dave


Huh?? I don't think there is a DV deck the does not record, the JVC does also. It may not be a 'true MiniDV VCR' because of its terrible problem and repair history but it certanly does record. DV decks are hardly for the domain of only 'corporations' Most serious videographers I know have dedicated DV decks. (I have 5 digital decks, but I am an equipment pig!) Those that don't have a deck usually have 1 chipper cam dedicated to use as a deck.


Beverly
User


Oct 8, 2005, 10:19 AM

Post #9 of 21 (3764 views)
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Re: [DaveC] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

"Just use your camcorder as a DV VCR and stop worrying about wearing it out. You can probably buy a new camcorder cheaper than a DV VCR. "

If you do much video work I would not suggest using your camera as a play and record deck. You will wear the heads on your camera so fast. In the long run it is much cheaper to purchase a dedicated dv deck.

You will keep maintance repairs on your cam down considerably and if you are doing the suggested cleaning on your cameras you will not have to do it as frequently. Most companies suggest cleaning every so many hours of recording or use. If you are using you camera as a deck you will need to get the cleanings done twice as often.




videobear
Veteran


Oct 8, 2005, 2:38 PM

Post #10 of 21 (3755 views)
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Re: [Beverly] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
If you do much video work I would not suggest using your camera as a play and record deck. You will wear the heads on your camera so fast. In the long run it is much cheaper to purchase a dedicated dv deck.


Well, I do have a deck, and I much prefer it to using a camcorder for the purpose. However, while the "it'll wear out your camera" concern used to be the conventional wisdom, I don't think it applies in today's world...as long as you are simply dumping entire tapes to your hard drive. If you're logging individual clips and capturing them from the tape, you can wind up putting quite a bit of wear on the tape transport, but one pass per tape for capture, and one more pass at the end to record the finished project, just isn't that significant.

Let's do a thought experiment: Say I buy a VX-2100. This camera is good for about 2000 hours on the heads, with a professional cleaning done, say, once per year. Now, I shoot 30 weddings a year with it, burning up about, let's say, four tapes per event. That's 120 hours of shooting, and another 120 hours of capturing. I also use the camera to record a DV master. Let's say that takes two 60 minute tapes, for another 60 hours of use. That comes to 120+120+60 = 300 hours per year. I can figure the camera will last, on average, 2000/300 = 6.7 years life expectancy. Since I plan on replacing my camera about once every 4 years, this give me plenty of safety margin.

But, as I said, I really do prefer the convenience of having a deck permanently installed in my equipment rack. It saves the time of hooking up the camcorder, saves stress on the camera's firewire port, has superior noise reduction electronics, a faster and more accurate tape transport...and it will also handle full size (2 or 3 hour) DV cassettes.




Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions


ivey
Veteran


Oct 8, 2005, 4:48 PM

Post #11 of 21 (3751 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

Buy yourself a consumer grade DV camera. Something like the Canon ZR series for a couple hundred bucks. That way you'll save the wear and tear on your professional camera.





Cheers,
Lisa Power









dansen
User


Oct 12, 2005, 10:01 AM

Post #12 of 21 (3615 views)
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Re: [ivey] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

Will the quality of what I'm transferring be as good if I use a consumer camcorder to put the DV into my G5? If I was to use a $800 external DV deck wouldn't that be sturdier, last longer, not damage the head of the cheap camera and maybe the quality would be better? Also, I'm sure there'd be a higher output speed for transferring the DV in the proper deck than just the camera?


videobear
Veteran


Oct 12, 2005, 10:20 AM

Post #13 of 21 (3613 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

The quality of the image from a deck is arguably slightly better. Decks generally contain better electronics for dropout avoidance and image sharpening. Also, some decks (notably Sony professional models) have a tendency to be more forgiving of tapes recorded in cameras with non-standard tape path alignments.

However, an $800 deck will probably NOT produce these advantages. The things that it'll do better than a cheap DV camcorder are:
- It's always hooked up, so you don't have to keep plugging and unplugging things.
- The tape will fast forward, rewind, and shuttle between points faster
- You may have more flexibility in choice of shuttling speeds, making it quicker to find a particular frame.

A potential downside is the reverse of that "forgiving" advantage I mentioned above. DV, as a format, is not very tolerant of differences in tape transport alignment. Hence, a tape recorded in one camera may not play back in another camera or deck. The probability of this increases if you record in LP mode.

Unless you can afford $1K or more for a deck, I'd go with Ivey's recommendation.




Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions


dansen
User


Oct 12, 2005, 2:46 PM

Post #14 of 21 (3605 views)
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Re: [videobear] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

Appreciate the advice. I'm torn between a Canon XL2 and a VX2100 at the moment. I'm sure most of you have used these cameras - I'm ashamed to say I haven't. What do you think I should go for. I want to use it to make my own films and to use it for making weddings and corporate videos etc.

If I buy a 2nd hand consumer grade camcorder for 1 or 200 Euro I can not only use it for shooting holidays and carrying it around with me, but also as a deck to import DV into my G5. Sound good to me.

However, because I'm going to be offering duplication as a service, maybe a deck with a DVD and a VHS PAL slot (are all 3 available as one?), is a good idea. I'm looking for a DV deck that I can slot a DVD or PAL VHS tape into and import it into my G5. Change to NTSC or edit or whatever in the computer with Final Cut Pro. Output back to...........what....using what??


VidMan
Veteran


Oct 19, 2005, 7:06 PM

Post #15 of 21 (3508 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

I just bought the Samsung SC-D353 at Circuit City for under $300. That is my new miniDV deck (no more play back on my GL2). I'm capturing a tape now. And heck, I can bring it with me and you never know when someone will want a flower-girl cam!
Brian
______________________________________________
VU Virginia Chapter


dansen
User


Oct 20, 2005, 8:42 AM

Post #16 of 21 (3494 views)
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Re: [VidMan] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

I was looking at the camera on the Circuit City website. I'm amazed at the price for a brand new camera. Not bad for a DV deck and a camera that you can just carry around with you and shoot stuff... You could also use it to take still pictures...


Juzcoping
New User

Oct 20, 2005, 11:44 AM

Post #17 of 21 (3481 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

Get a hammer and give the screen a few whacks until it breaks. That should do the trick.


dansen
User


Oct 20, 2005, 11:48 AM

Post #18 of 21 (3479 views)
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Re: [Juzcoping] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

I'll try that.


Juzcoping
New User

Oct 20, 2005, 11:51 AM

Post #19 of 21 (3475 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

I bet you will as well.


dansen
User


Oct 20, 2005, 3:43 PM

Post #20 of 21 (3457 views)
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Re: [Juzcoping] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

Damn, it didn't work.


VidMan
Veteran


Nov 2, 2005, 9:42 AM

Post #21 of 21 (3339 views)
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Re: [dansen] External DV Decks [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm returning the Samsung camera. Too many problems playing tapes recorded from my GL2. I am going to try the JVC SR-VS30U.

I'll let you know how it goes.
Brian
______________________________________________
VU Virginia Chapter