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Home: Video University Forums: Tech Q & A:
Quality Improvement Suggestions

PopeJohn
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Aug 17, 2005, 3:24 PM

Post #1 of 9 (904 views)
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Quality Improvement Suggestions	Can't Post

After 3 years of serious video recording and editing, I am very happy with all of my equipment and skill level... but I still don't feel like my final DVD output looks as good as it should from an image quality standpoint. I am shifting my focus now to correct that problem and I need some suggestions/feedback from video folks more knowledgable than I...

1) The most obvious improvement I can think of is getting a Dual-layer DVD writer in order to compress MPEG at higher bit-rates. Any suggestions for models that are well-priced and produce reliable discs? Also, which media? Right now I use an HP writer and Fuji discs.

2) On my first editing PC I purchased a Pinnacle/Premiere 6.0 bundle which included a Pinnacle DV compressor. On my current PC, I am using the default Microsoft compressor on Premiere 6.5 and my Pinnacle plug-ins don't work with 6.5. I feel like my altered footage used to look better on my old system, but maybe my memory is playing tricks on me. When I apply video filters (i.e. "image flip" or "zoom"), the rendered footage seems overly degraded to me. My buddy uses Vegas 4 and I feel like his rendered output looks closer to the original footage quality than mine, even when applying a digital zoom (which is especially annoying since all of my hardware is superior). Is there a compressor I should get or a setting I should tweak in 6.5? NOTE: Switching editing platforms is not an option for me right now.

For the record, my workflow is as follows:

PD 170 footage -> Premiere 6.5 -> Rendered AVI -> DVD Architect -> DVD

Any suggestions improving the look of my final product will be very appreciated. Thanks,

John

videobear
Veteran

Aug 17, 2005, 3:34 PM

Post #2 of 9 (901 views)
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Re: [PopeJohn] Quality Improvement Suggestions [In reply to]	Can't Post

The Microsoft transcoder ain't the best of the bunch. Vegas has a very good transcoder, and you can get the same quality outside of Vegas with TMPGEnc. You can download a free version at http://www.tmpgenc.net/e_main.html

I wouldn't worry about dual layer DVDs. They have compatibility issues of their own with both authoring applications and client players. If you want to encode at a higher bitrate, and your program won't fit on a single disk, make a two-disc set.

Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions

PopeJohn
User

Aug 17, 2005, 3:45 PM

Post #3 of 9 (898 views)
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Re: [videobear] Quality Improvement Suggestions [In reply to]	Can't Post

Is there an easy way to get Adobe to use a different compressor when exporting "DV AVI" files from the timeline?

All of my MPEG encoding is done in DVD Architect, which uses the same as Vegas... but I feel like my degradation happens before that step.

videobear
Veteran

Aug 17, 2005, 3:51 PM

Post #4 of 9 (896 views)
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Re: [PopeJohn] Quality Improvement Suggestions [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hmm. Well, my copy of 6.5 used the Canopus DV codec with no complaints, back when I had my DV Storm card in the system. Not sure what to tell you here, since I've never tried to marry different DV codecs with Premiere.

On the MPEG2 encoding, I'd say go ahead and try TMPGEnc anyway. Yes, it's basically the same transcoder, but you get a lot more control over the process than you do by letting DVDA call all the shots.

Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions

PopeJohn
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Aug 17, 2005, 3:57 PM

Post #5 of 9 (894 views)
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Re: [videobear] Quality Improvement Suggestions [In reply to]	Can't Post

Yeah... like I said... My Premiere 6.0 used a Pinnacle codec and I think things looked better before the MPEG encode. I figured there would be a plug-in for an upgraded DV AVI codec.

Can you tell me the best export settings to use, maybe something got messed up there... "lower frame first", etc...

I have always left that stuff alone, but these days I'm thinking I should look into it...

videobear
Veteran

Aug 17, 2005, 4:23 PM

Post #6 of 9 (890 views)
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Re: [PopeJohn] Quality Improvement Suggestions [In reply to]	Can't Post

lower frame first, of course.
I seem to get the best results with 2 pass VBR, adjusting the average bitrate so the project will fit in the available space. I try for an average not less than 6 Mb/sec. Max bitrate shouldn't exceed 8 Mb/sec, to leave room for the audio. I encode audio to AC3 and import it separately; quality remains good, and AC3 takes up less space.

For more discussion on DVD authoring and bitrates, see Ed Troxel's newletter. Vol 1 #7, at http://thetroxels.com/tts/

Regards,
Doug Graham
Panda Productions

PopeJohn
User

Aug 17, 2005, 4:33 PM

Post #7 of 9 (889 views)
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Re: [videobear] Quality Improvement Suggestions [In reply to]	Can't Post

I'm starting to wish I had never mentioned MPEG encoding in my post(s)... as that is not where my dissatisfaction lies...

Even when I export my timeline to DV tape and watch the output from the camera, I do not feel like my image quality is being maintained on the segments that have been manipulated/filtered, etc... When watching the DV tape, I can detect a noticable change in "clarity" during parts that I know have been adjusted in Premiere. I doubt ANY of my clients ever notice it, but it bugs me... I have to imagine this can only be corrected by using a codec that handles and renders the DV AVI files better... but I am not sure. I'd like to try something, so I can at least say I did and ease my own mind a little.

Regardless, thank you for your feedback, I will look into your suggestions on improving the MPEG encoding process.

djtoltz
User

Aug 17, 2005, 7:49 PM

Post #8 of 9 (872 views)
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Re: [PopeJohn] Quality Improvement Suggestions [In reply to]	Can't Post

I heard that Avid had the best DV codec in the world, and that they made it available free of charge. You may want to check into that. I've been thinking of installing it on my Mac, to compare to the Apple DV/DVCPRO codec which seems to be pretty good.

Depending on what sort of processing you are doing in Premiere, quality losses can sneak in when values get clipped early in a processing stream, resulting in loss of color resolution. I noticed, with Premiere, that adding saturation produced really ugly results. There, it was just a matter of shoddy programming.
---
Douglas Toltzman
Hubert, NC

PopeJohn
User

Aug 18, 2005, 9:34 AM

Post #9 of 9 (830 views)
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Re: [djtoltz] Quality Improvement Suggestions [In reply to]	Can't Post

I would greatly appreciate any help finding this codec and especially getting Premiere to use it.

I'll look into it for now... thanks djtoltz.