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Home: Video University Forums: Wedding & Event Videography:
Sony Z7U Lens Issue Update - UPDATE 04/23/08

 

 


glimmer
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Apr 18, 2008, 12:47 PM

Post #1 of 8 (1001 views)
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Sony Z7U Lens Issue Update - UPDATE 04/23/08 Can't Post

I am creating a new post as I hate how all of the others get skewed and off topic. So, here's the story with regards to the focusing issues. If you're not familiar with this issue, find the previous post.

1 > If you are having focusing issues pertaining to the manual focus as I had written about in the previous post, YOU MUST LET ME KNOW ASAP. If you are having this problem, reply with information on what setup you used and/or samples. If not, post as well.

2 > Bruce and I are overnighting our cameras to Sony and they are having a tech from Japan fly in to examine these issues.

3 > I will update everyone as applicable but probably not until the middle of next week.


PLEASE ONLY POST IF YOU ARE AN OWNER OF THIS CAMERA AND HAVE RESULTS REGARDING THE ISSUE AT HAND. I NEED TO CREATE A LIST OF WHO HAS THE PROBLEM AND WHO DOES NOT AS PER SONY'S REQUEST. IF THIS DOES NOT GET DONE IT WILL NOT GET RECTIFIED.

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original post for reference - http://www.videouniversity.com/...;;page=unread#unread

Info regarding issue:::

Zoom in on objects that have a similar focal distance with regards to where they are....makes sense....focus on the center object at full telephoto and zoom out. The left-most area will appear blurred. Zoom back in and pan to any of these objects and they are in focus. The concept is simple and if you don't understand, think of it this way - if you film a wedding and zoom into a bride/groom in the center aisle, the zoom out, the left side will be out of focus whereas the center and right will be in focus. But, if you zoom back in, the focus is intact. That's a serious problem.

Here's a link for the non-believers or whatever....

http://rapidshare.com/files/108111585/test002.wmv.html - I am not leaving this link up for too long.
http://www.vimeo.com/908039
It's 89 seconds long. Can't be more obvious. Consistent on ALL cameras. (ref:glimmer)

Dont forget you have to open your iris all the way to 1.8-2.0 when you are at telephoto 75-80%. If you get way overexposed just turn your ND filters on an if that is not enough then start raising your shutter speed. If you have plenty of light your auto controls will never reach these settings. If you hav elow light like a reception then your camera will get to these settings, which is why it is important to resolve these issues because low light footage is tough enough to deal with blurring it makes it look crappier. For any film look folk this is critical because this is where you live in your camera when generating shallow DOF (ref:bruceo)


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04.23.08 Update

So Far So Good!!!!
Just spoke with Dominic (nice guy) and he told me that Sony has confirmed and been able to reproduce the problem with regards to the focusing/zoom issues parallel to the "soup clip" that I posted last week.

So, as it stands, here's what I was told in terms of time frames:

>Tomorrow - will get a call regarding when I'll get my equipment back and follow up with what is going to happen.
>Friday - Should have an answer as far as resolution to these issues.

Slowly but surely, but I'm partially happy thus far!


For more info, check out the dvinfo.net forums - I have many more posts there about these issues.


(This post was edited by glimmer on Apr 23, 2008, 5:36 PM)


Shawn Lam
User


Apr 18, 2008, 2:37 PM

Post #2 of 8 (958 views)
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Re: [glimmer] Sony Z7U Lens Issue Update - OWNERS MUST READ THIS [In reply to] Can't Post

Sorry for the delay in responding with my results - I have been extremely busy and only now have had the time to take a closer look to see if my Z7 has the same problem.

I am happy to report that I cannot replicate the blur problem.

I tried at least 6 times in different settings. So it appears like the problem may not affect the entire line.


Shawn Lam, MPV

Shawn Lam Video
Vancouver BC
BCPVA President
EventDV Columnist
WEVA & 4EverGroup Presenter


Sparky
Veteran

Apr 18, 2008, 3:53 PM

Post #3 of 8 (935 views)
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Re: [glimmer] Sony Z7U Lens Issue Update - OWNERS MUST READ THIS [In reply to] Can't Post

Glimmer ... Please make sure that my name gets added to your list.

My camera came in on Monday and that was the first test I ran. The left side of the lens is definitely out of focus for this test.

Thank yous go out to both you and Bruce for pursuing this problem.

Scott Brooks



bruceo
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Apr 20, 2008, 4:30 PM

Post #4 of 8 (787 views)
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Re: [Shawn Lam] Sony Z7U Lens Issue Update - OWNERS MUST READ THIS [In reply to] Can't Post

Shawn are you sure you executed the test properly? Weren't you the one who also said the Z7 did not have any rolling shutter issues?..... It seems that pretty much anyone who has properly executed this test has found that they have the same problem. http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?p=863940#post86394



First Sight Pictures



JC/DV
Veteran


Apr 20, 2008, 5:16 PM

Post #5 of 8 (777 views)
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Re: [bruceo] Sony Z7U Lens Issue Update - OWNERS MUST READ THIS [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Weren't you the one who also said the Z7 did not have any rolling shutter issues?.....


I thought EVERY CMOS camcorder on the planet today has the rolling shutter issue because they aren't set to global shutter like a CCD.

Jerome
JC/DV Productions - Website - Blog

Technology. It does wonders if you know how to use it.


Shawn Lam
User


Apr 20, 2008, 6:54 PM

Post #6 of 8 (754 views)
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Re: [bruceo] Sony Z7U Lens Issue Update - OWNERS MUST READ THIS [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm very sure I tested the camera properly. I was very careful. I spent over an hour trying to replicate the issue in a variety of settings. From the posts that I saw the problem is very dramatic and there was nothing in my footage to suggest there is a problem with my unit. I looked at the footage on the LCD while recording, on my HDTV afterwards, and on Premiere Pro CS3. I even exported frames and viewed them in Photoshop.

Now be careful with misconstruing my words... Regarding the rolling shutter I never said "the Z7 did not have any rolling shutter issues". Here are my statements from FreshDV and VU regarding rolling shutter on the Z7U. I stand behind them and I feel they are a fair assessment. Photographer flashes suck for video regardless of sensor type and from what I could see the two sensors handle flashes differently and they are both distracting but I did not feel that CMOS was dramatically worse, from my experiences at the time and up until this point.


Quote
Quick note on the rolling shutter and CMOS. I took some photos with flash of the front of the camera and played it back. You can see the rolling shutter issue but in slow mo but it didn't seem like a big deal. In regular time it looks like a different pattern but did not distract anymore than a CCD reaction to a flash.

Not sure if you can film police cars at night but for wedding ceremonies and the like a photographer's flash shouldn't kill your footage.






Quote
Rolling Shutter - I looked at my real-world footage of a cheer competion where cameras were allowed and couldn’t say there is a problem with the way the camera handles sudden flashes of unsustained and irregular light. Depending if the flash lasted a single frame or lingered in one before and after it, the image was only disrupted for the duration of the flash. I was expecting the affected frames to be blown-out exposure wise but did notice some pixelation and artifacts. When viewed in regular time it looks like someone took a photo using a flash so I can’t say it will be a problem either.




Quote

As I mentioned in the VU review I noticed a slight roll in the shutter when I took a photo with flash of the camcorder but I didn’t notice any random artifacts. From that initial test I don’t see a problem with normal usage, such as a wedding ceremony with flash photography but I think a more challenging test will be something even more dramatic, like a cop car with lights flashing at night.



Shawn Lam, MPV

Shawn Lam Video
Vancouver BC
BCPVA President
EventDV Columnist
WEVA & 4EverGroup Presenter


bruceo
Veteran


Apr 20, 2008, 11:34 PM

Post #7 of 8 (716 views)
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Re: [Shawn Lam] Sony Z7U Lens Issue Update - OWNERS MUST READ THIS [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm not trying to misconstrue your words and I am appreciative of you taking the time to get out your initial impressions. I am referring to your event DV review http://www.eventdv.net/...aspx?ArticleID=41396 where you say the Z7u has none of the CMOS problems of the V1u. You later say you could not reproduce problems referring to wobble and skew with no mention of the other most talked about CMOS issue of split exposures during flashes. The fact that screen has mixed exposure during flashes proves that wobble and skew will still occur because rolling shutter is exactly what causes these problems because you have different parts of the same frame that were actually exposed at different times you get, split flash, wobble and skew. SO the rolling shutter will cause aesthetic problems with slomo and sometimes moving footage and will cause major problems for anyone in compositing.


First Sight Pictures



glimmer
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Apr 23, 2008, 5:53 PM

Post #8 of 8 (580 views)
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Re: [glimmer] Sony Z7U Lens Issue Update - UPDATE 04/23/08 [In reply to] Can't Post

read update