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Home: Video University Forums: Wedding & Event Videography:
Sync

 

 


X-Dan_Holden
Imported Account

Nov 15, 2002, 6:35 PM

Post #1 of 7 (1158 views)
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Sync Can't Post

I'm stumped. When it comes to recording audio in multitrack studios, from 2" reel-to-reel to Hard Disc recording, I've done my fair share... about 11 years worth... And with video, I've been dabbling for 6 years, and been pro for 2, so I feel like I've encountered and solved many a problem. Here's the deal...
Anytime in the past, when I've had to sync up MiniDisc audio with the video I captured, it's synced up perfectly. A few weeks ago the band I'm in did a 4 cam shoot. All cams with MiniDV, and they all sync up fine. The audio was recorded live to Hard Disc in a program called Cakewalk. (Now, Cakewalk is the program I always import my MiniDisc audio into for vows and reception audio for weddings, so I am extremely familiar with it. Also I've been using Cakewalk to record and mix music for bands for a couple years as well.) Everything has always synced up. Until now. I've seen in posts here before people manually dropping frames to compensate, but I'd have to do that for over an hour's worth of footage, and it goes out of sync within a minute, so that'd be a lot of work!!! Also, it seems like I'd have to add frames, not drop them, because the audio goes longer than the video. Is this a 48000Hz or 44100Hz vs 32000Hz problem, or a dropframe vs non-drop problem, or what? I've never seen this before with digital gear, everything's worked before. I'm wondering, and have yet to double-check, if the Cakewalk settings were wrong when we recorded everything. By the way, I'm not sure how many of you are familiar with the recording process, but it was a multitracked live show, not just a stereo recording of the board outputs... We had mics on everything being recorded onto individual channels, so we're able to mix the show after for better sound quality than just a board mix. I'm stuck. I've tried seeing if maybe some songs worked and others didn't, but no, it's all not syncing up. Hopefully the fix is obvious and I'm an idiot. If not, D'OH!!
Thanks, Dan
(the link to my band's site for any interested... www.mysisterocean.com **warning, it's radio friendly Alternative Rock! I wouldn't try it on any wedding videos, but who knows! See if "Pictures" works for ya. It's a nice acoustic diddy)


X-Doug_Graham
Imported Account

Nov 15, 2002, 8:27 PM

Post #2 of 7 (1157 views)
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Re: Sync Can't Post

It might be a drop frame vs. non-drop frame time code issue, especially if you're losing sync within a minute. If you can't determine what frame rate the Cakewalk output is at, or change it if need be, then try this:
First, make sure that the sample rate of the clip from the MD source is sampled at the same rate as the video's audio (either 32 or 48 KHz, depending on whether you recorded the video's audio tracks at 12 or 16 bits). Resample the .wav file if necessary, before importing it into your NLE. This probably isn't causing your sync problem, but it can't hurt and will make the job of your NLE easier.
Second, find an identifiable audio cue near the start and another near the end of the material. Trim both the video clip and the MD audio clip to these cues. Match up the clips and note the length difference, if any.
Third, open up the MD clip in SoundForge or your audio editor of choice and use the Length Adjustment tool (whatever it's called in your own audio editor). I mean, the "thing that lets you change the overall duration of a clip without affecting its pitch" tool. Save under a new name and import the new clip back into your NLE. The length should now match the video clip and you should be in sync.
Regards,
Doug Graham


X-Dan_Holden
Imported Account

Nov 16, 2002, 2:31 AM

Post #3 of 7 (1157 views)
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Re: Sync [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks kindly! Great suggestions, I noticed that in the "Audio Clock" setting of CAkewalk that it's default was 30 Frames Non-Drop, whereas video is drop-frame right? So if I change that, that might work.... If that doesn't work, I'll try the other thing. Thanks again! Dan


X-Dave_Bonner
Imported Account

Nov 16, 2002, 5:04 AM

Post #4 of 7 (1157 views)
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Re: Sync cant help but your playing here next I see [In reply to] Can't Post

The great alberta Tour ;)
good luck at the horse, I use to hang out there, way back when.
Later
Dave


X-Dave_Bonner
Imported Account

Nov 16, 2002, 5:15 AM

Post #5 of 7 (1157 views)
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Re: Sync doh [In reply to] Can't Post

I didnt realize Phase Productions is who you are. I have you linked to my site :)
Later and good luck with your sync issues
Dave


X-Doug_Graham
Imported Account

Nov 16, 2002, 12:56 PM

Post #6 of 7 (1157 views)
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Re: Sync [In reply to] Can't Post

: Thanks kindly! Great suggestions, I noticed that in the "Audio Clock" setting of CAkewalk that it's default was 30 Frames Non-Drop, whereas video is drop-frame right? So if I change that, that might work.... If that doesn't work, I'll try the other thing. Thanks again! Dan
Yes, DV's "default" time code is drop frame. Unless your video footage was recorded on a pro camera that also offers NDF, that's probably the source of your problem.
Regards,
Doug Graham


X-Dan_Holden
Imported Account

Nov 16, 2002, 1:55 PM

Post #7 of 7 (1157 views)
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Re: Sync [In reply to] Can't Post

Doug, thanks again. I adjusted the Time and made it .02% faster, and now it syncs up perfectly! Usually I've found with Time Compression that you get artifacts, but I remembered that's primarily when you stretch audio to make it longer. I had to make it a little shorter, so the audio quality is still great and in sync, so I am a happy camper. Cheers, Dan